Stage piano w/ good synths - NS3 vs alternatives?

[neomad]

...My new band plays a lot of 80s covers and I find my rig just isn't cutting the mustard when it comes to synth sounds..

Hello, and welcome to the Forum. I can't add much to the great comments above but to say that I've found the Stage 3 very well suited for covering songs from the 80s. Pairing your preferred Roland RD2000 with a Stage 3 Compact as noted by cphollis would be a great duo. Here are some examples covering synths from the 70s/80s playing only the Stage 3, no overdubs, and sometimes adding a drum track. Along with being able to tap into some very knowledgeable folks, this Forum is loaded with programs and samples provided freely by many members to help get you started. Good luck to you!

• Cars Lets Go W.mp3

• Stage 3 Cars Just What I Needed 2.mp3

• Toto Africa S1 W Sample Demo.mp3

• MP3 - Who Baba ORiley.mp3

• VH Jump V2 - Van Halen Jump.mp3

• Stage 3 - Styx Foolin Yourself Intro.mp3

• Styx 2MuchTime W Program with Sample.mp3

• Waiting4AGirl W - Foreigner - Waiting For A Girl.mp3

• ELO Telephone Line Intro Verse and Chorus Programs - Short.mp3

• Stage 3 - Loverboy Turn Me Loose.mp3

• WH HowWillKnow W Program with Sample.mp3

• Cameo - Word Up W NSMP Example.mp3

That's is very true, WannitBBBad. You are one of the guys that make me keep my NS3 within my rig when I get frustrated with the Synth section. Thanks to you, and many others, I can found the programs that I need (vs programming as I do with other boards).

[neomad]

Why not a RD2000 + NW2? you will really cover all !

[anotherscott]

Why not a RD2000 + NW2? you will really cover all !

I don't think RD2000 organ keeps up with Nord organ.

[Kaffimusic]

The synth section sounds solid and it´s fun to program anlog-style sounds on it.
But be aware you just have 2 of them the same time. When you want to play samples, one synth section is gone for that. You can do sample keymaps with splits in them, but all will run thorugh the same synth settings. Spiltpoints have been mentioned. It should also be mentioned that you do not have any rom-based sounds in it, so when you want all the usual bread and butter sample based sounds you have to load them into the sampling ram, that is 480MB. To make them sound and feel good, you also might have to program suitable synth programs for them. The Nord comes with that already, but most of what came with it was not really overwhelmingly well done (just my opinion). Like in the electro (I guess) you have no velocity switching. The other 2GB sampling ram are for the piano only and only for that. the piano engine is a sample player only, there is no tuning in with envelopes, filters and stuff. You have to live with the options that come, they are okay with some EQing or response settings to velocity.
Sample management in the instrument is extrodinary simple and fast to do, I see it as an example like it should be in other instruments, too.
You are familiar with the Electro, so I guess you can say it´s basically the same with double piano, double organ and double synth on top of it. You can get things done and prepared pretty fast, because it is very easy to program. On the other hand it is not the most flexible instrument. When you are not used to program your stuff extensively, you probably will not even notice the shortcomings.
Other instruments in that pricerange offer more, but they are usually harder to program. Sound, especially pianosound and feel is a very personal choice, that is up to you. I guess you will have to test other gear to make a solid decision.

[aperturevx]

Thanks all for your input so far, very useful.

I went to a music store that had both yesterday and tried them back and forth for about 3 hrs playing all sorts of styles, classical, jazz, funk, pop, top 40, etc. Also tried out quite a few sounds. At the end of it, now I just want to own them both! The music store also had a Fantom 8 which was fun, but as expected, way too big and heavy to be practical for gigging. So that rules out the Fantom, Montage, and the like. As for Kronos, it looks awesome but they don't make them anymore, and there aren't any used 88-key models in my area. I've also heard that the Korg action is not as good as Roland or Nord (esp. for classical work.)

I am now quite tempted to replace my whole rig and do what some of you suggested, RD2000 on the bottom and NS3 compact on top. They would complement each other so well. That way I get all the sounds I need, plus both types of action I want, etc. The only problem is, it costs about $10k CAD for both. My better half would kill me if she found out, lol.

As mentioned the biggest thing I want is an upgrade in action, but I need better synth sounds pretty immediately for some gigs coming up. In the short term, better synths > better action in terms of priorities. I think I will get the NS3 88 as a temp solution which will give me both and work as a one-board solution. I can pair it with the Electro for the waterfall action for organ & synth work when needed. I think I can live with the limited strings/horns and fixed split points for now. In a gig setting, most listeners won't hear the difference anyway. The action, while not as good as the Roland's, is still stellar by most digital piano standards and good enough for most classical pieces, if not perfect. When I've saved up some more pennies I can trade it and the Electro in for RD2000 + NS3 compact on top.

[neomad]

Why not a RD2000 + NW2? you will really cover all !

I don't think RD2000 organ keeps up with Nord organ.

Very true, I missed the organ section as such.

[WannitBBBad]

...but I need better synth sounds pretty immediately for some gigs coming up. In the short term, better synths > better action in terms of priorities. I think I will get the NS3 88 as a temp solution which will give me both and work as a one-board solution. I can pair it with the Electro for the waterfall action for organ & synth work when needed. I think I can live with the limited strings/horns and fixed split points for now.

Thanks for your update! Regarding the fixed split points, though you are somewhat limited by that for internal sounds, using the synth section of the Stage 3 (or any other keyboard including your Electro with a sample loaded), you can create your own Nord samples with split points anywhere you'd like for sample playback on both the Stage 3 and Electro 4.

If you haven't tried it, Nord sample creation with the Nord Sample Editor 4 is extremely easy and it can really expand what you are able to do with your Electro 4. I have quite a few examples posted at nord-user-samples-nsmp-samples-f14/40-s ... 21907.html that you can load into your Electro 4 today. Take care.

[aperturevx]

If you haven't tried it, Nord sample creation with the Nord Sample Editor 4 is extremely easy and it can really expand what you are able to do with your Electro 4. I have quite a few examples posted at nord-user-samples-nsmp-samples-f14/40-s ... 21907.html that you can load into your Electro 4 today. Take care.

Thanks! This is one of the reasons I will get the NS3, there is so much community support and people sharing their programs & samples online. I did some searching on the Roland forums and there isn't nearly the level of online community support for the RD2000.

Another newbie question - once I have the stage I will want to use my electro as a MIDI slave just for the action, with all sounds coming from the Stage. Does the Electro send drawbar positions over MIDI? (ie, can I use the physical drawbars on the Electro to modify the organ tone on the Stage in real time while I play? This is very useful for solos)

thanks!

[maxpiano]

Another newbie question - once I have the stage I will want to use my electro as a MIDI slave just for the action, with all sounds coming from the Stage. Does the Electro send drawbar positions over MIDI? (ie, can I use the physical drawbars on the Electro to modify the organ tone on the Stage in real time while I play? This is very useful for solos)

thanks!

Yes but I am not sure the CCs of the NS3 and NE4 drawbars match (check the respective manuals CC Appendix), in that case you will need to add a MIDI processor (CC remapper) in between.

[anotherscott]

At the end of it, now I just want to own them both!

When you say both, which two are you talking about?

As for Kronos, it looks awesome but they don't make them anymore, and there aren't any used 88-key models in my area.

The Nautilus 88 gives you almost all the same capabilities and sounds. You'd lose aftertouch, KARMA, and having so many simultaneous real-time hard controls.

I've also heard that the Korg action is not as good as Roland or Nord (esp. for classical work.)

It's subjective, but I'd agree that the 88 in the Kronos was not a first-rate action, I don't like it personally. Oddly, I preferred the action in the SV1/SV2 even though, on paper, it's the same RH3 as what's on the Kronos except for the lack of aftertouch. So I'm hesitant to make assumptions about the feel of the Nautilus until I get to play one.

If something with an action roughly in the Nord 88 quality range could be acceptable, I'll also suggest the possibility of the Kurzweil K2700 at 52 lbs, or the 48 lb Forte 8 which it is replacing, which you might find a good deal on. The Kurzweils use a more lightly weighted version of the same basic action as the Nord. It could meet your requirements. The synth capabilities of the Kurz are excellent, albeit not the easiest to work with. And it's good with the orchestral sounds.

Regarding the fixed split points, though you are somewhat limited by that for internal sounds, using the synth section of the Stage 3 (or any other keyboard including your Electro with a sample loaded), you can create your own Nord samples with split points anywhere you'd like for sample playback on both the Stage 3 and Electro 4.

Certainly worth noting, but also with the caveat that there are significant limitations since the Nord considers the splits sounds to be a single sound, so you then can't do something like apply an effect or envelope setting or foot pedal function to one of your split sounds but not the other.