The C2/C2d vs 2nd generation clones like the Korg Bx3,Roland

[rippinux]

Okay, Tacitus requested a new thread. Fine with me. Has any of you C1/C2/C2d owners ever had any of the so-called 'Second-Generation' clones, such as the Korg BX3, the Roland VK77 or VK88, the Viscount DB5, etc ? And if so, what advances, great or small, have been made with the current crop of clones like the C2d, Mojo,SK2,etc ?

[dlargent]

I used to own a BX3 (digital version). When I got my Nord C2, my life got a hell of a lot happier.

Here are the main advantages of the C2:

Only 35 lbs. versus 80 lbs. -- Why in the world does a digital keyboard have to weigh 80 lbs???

the C2 sounds so much more like a real Hammond. The difference is like night and day.

The C2 has support for bass pedals, Bx3 inexplicably didn't.

C2 has 11-pin output, Bx3 had no leslie connection.

With the C2, you can have a leslie attached to the 11-pin output, and have leslie simulator coming from the left-right 1/4" outputs. Very useful in clubs with a PA who are unable to mic the leslie.

I think the keyboard feel of the C2 is much better, but a little stiffer. I miss the drawbars of the Bx3.

OH YEAH - and you can update the software of the C2, which is now upgraded to the same sounds as the newer model.

[tacitus]

Before the C2D I used a Oberheim OB3 squared module, so I had to have a separate keyboard. Also, the Leslie sim on the Oberheim is laughable, so I used a Tube Rotosphere pedal for that, which was a lot better, though quite noisy (subjectively, noisier than the real thing). The actual B3 emulation on the Oberheim is not bad, though the modelling of the physical quirks of the B3 are much less advanced, and hence the overall sound is less convincing. That said, it was quite good in a band situation; just rather a mess with all the separate bits and wall warts.

Going back to the original clones, I have what is probably the 0th-generation original - a Yamaha combo organ with variable tab stops of most of the footages you get on a Hammond. Not really the same sound for hundreds of reasons, but flexible enough to get a good result through a Leslie. In fact, the Leslie is the key to it all, because once you put your organ of whatever sort through a screaming Leslie the effect is there even if it is noticeably 'not Hammond'. But I'd much rather gig with the Nord than take out the Yamaha, cool though it is, purely on weight grounds. 100 pounds+ just for the manuals, before Leslie and any other PA is a lot for a supposedly portable organ. And, true to form for a 60s or 70s organ, the legs have gone missing, too.

The final clincher for me was the Baroque organ in the Nord; my background is mainly classical and I will be using the organ for continuo work, outdoor concerts and so on where a proper organ sound is needed. All in all, the only practical way for me to go, and having such a good B3 emulation as well is just magnificent.

[rippinux]

Hey, Mr tacitus.

I had an OB3 squared module , too. I liked the basic sound, but the overdrive & leslie were useless. Still, leslie & drive aside, what i liked about the Oberheim was that it was convenient, had a good chorus/vibrato, & it was dependable. I also had an old Viscount op3 (1982?) which had a great analogue sound for 1982, & several Voce modules which sounded okay ( i really liked the V3 & the drawbar controller module, but i had countless electrical problems with them.. they were good for what they did, but the Nord totally demolished them in every department. I have the C2, which i am totally GA-Ga over . I use the Baroque organ for my CD's for certain Soundtrack selections.

[tacitus]

Yeah, I forgot to mention the overdrive, probably because I'm not a big overdrive user (gasps of horror as I'm arrested for treason, but the plain fact is that since I had a perforated eardrum I find most distortion unpleasant, so if I need to use it nowadays I keep it to a minimum). That said, the Oberheim distortion felt like that to me BEFORE I had the ear trouble.

I'm pretty much ga-ga abut my C2D, rippinix, and will be even more so when the pedals arrive!

[Magorgan92]

Try korg bx3 and mini vent 2. The original Ventilator was used by many high-profile touring artists including Chuck Leavell (Rolling Stones) and Craig Frost (Bob Seger). The Ventilator II is being used on the latest tours including Dawes, James Taylor, Styx, and many other major artists.

[M_a_c]

I still got the Roland VR-09 with the Ventilator1 in a Blues-Project. It is no Nord-organ, but vor 1/3 the price it sounds really good.
The Keybed has something good. I especially like the not so hard Key-Response and with that the easy and fast Re-Triggering of it.
And abou the Ventilator - I would say, the Ventilator can make a crying saw sounding damn like a Hammond.
I don´t use it with my Nords (even if I had a second Ventilator on hand), because I prefer the all-in-one Solution,
but imo there´s no better Leslie-Sim - even not in the Nords (but they are still good enough to be very good)...

[FeelinDank]

I don't actually own a Nord C1 or Nord C2 / C2d but hopefully will one day. I've heard their baroque organ in-person and enjoyed its sound. Have also seen a few gigs where someone is playing a Nord C1/C2 instead of a Stage or Electro ...pretty cool.

That said the clonewheel sound is more authentic on these Nord C's than the Roland VK-7 I had for a few years. Chorus/Vibrato and what I like to call "how far the overdrive knob can go before it sounds hokey" is much better on these Nords than what you find on the older generation of clonewheel. At least in headphones, all of the older 2nd gen keyboards sounded decent but I grew tired of the VK-7 Leslie-emulation, overdrive, etc. I couldn't get past about 15-20% of the overdrive knob being turned on the VK, Nord Electros are believable enough well passed 60% or so. Even higher up the Nords and Hammonds sound good. They've modeled vacuum tubes and Leslie cabinets amazingly well. I now play with the Hammond SK Pro but any of the Nords sound equally as great nowadays. Can play for hours and hours with headphones on and live and enjoy the sound. My VK-7 was a bit exhausting (even 10+ years ago when it was 'old' by that time).

I saw a Nord C2D with gig bag, Nord Pedal 27 and a stand for $1500 or so on Guitar Center's website a few months ago ...I should have sprung for it.