What is missing in Rhodes sampling of the Nord?

[HrSys]

I do not know if it's just me, but the Nord Rhodes do not sound convincing to me, they do not have much dynamics (with EP7 being too expressive but something is missing), some notes have Key-Off samples and some do not and do not have mechanical noises of the instrument as key noises.

Other keyboard brands have more real Rhodes, such as: Yamaha's Reface CP that uses SCM (Spectral Component Modeling) + AWM2 as tone generator and Yamaha CP88 and Montage that use AWM2 as synthesis, and Crumar Seven uses physical modeling for his Rhodes sound.

Enhanced EP collection has improved the samples a bit, but it looks like something is still missing.
Would physical modeling be the solution?

[baekgaard]

To me they sound pretty much like a real Rhodes, with the variations in between individual keys as you would typically find on a real instrument. There are other options for modelled instruments, including VSTs, where you can adjust the amount of key off etc. I have some, but like the Nord better (and it is more portable).

You have 8 different Rhodes sounds, and with 5 additional filters, you have 48 variants to start out with even before using EQ and effects and amp simulation etc. The amount of key off varies between samples but you can use the soft release to make it less pronounced. EP2 in Dyno mode had plenty, in my opinion.

So in practice I never have problems finding a Rhodes sound I want. I currently play the EP4, EP8 bc and EP8 most. EP4 can be really mellow with the soft filter. EP8 had nice bell with the bright filter. EP2 had a lot of body and sustain, etc.

What board so you play? The kbd touch option can also make a big difference in how the dynamics varies, so maybe you should try the others too?

I think the stage HA and the SW keys both are very playable, although different (not do much experience with the HP version). Both works for me for Rhodes (with preference to the HA).

[toniolito]

baekgaard: I'm not sure you're aware that evandrolino owns a NS2EX. On this board, enhanced EPs don't include dynamic filters which is a significant feature.

evandrolino: maybe dyno filters feature is the enhancement that you expect.

[baekgaard]

baekgaard: I'm not sure you're aware that evandrolino owns a NS2EX. On this board, enhanced EPs don't include dynamic filters which is a significant feature.

evandrolino: maybe dyno filters feature is the enhancement that you expect.

I didn't see (at least via Tapatalk) that @evandrolino uses a 2EX. Then the filters are not built in, and more work is needed with EQ to achieve some of the effects. Dyno settings will be difficult to do with EQ, though.

[baekgaard]

I miss the pedal squeak...

[baekgaard]

I miss the pedal squeak...

I have an old pedal that provides this effect...

[anotherscott]

Other keyboard brands have more real Rhodes, such as...Montage that use AWM2 as synthesis, and Crumar Seven uses physical modeling for his Rhodes sound...Would physical modeling be the solution?[

It can also be subjective... I actually prefer Nord's EPs to Montage/MODX (same EPs). But the comparison is skewed by the operations of the boards. I get the Nord sounding the way I want with EQ, and I've never tried EQ on the MODX. Just because the way I use the Nord, I am geared toward tweaking, and the way I use the Yamaha, I generally don't, since it's not as straight-forward.

Sampling and modeling can both produce good results. My favorite EPs in a board are still the ones from the Korg SV1 which is sample based and 10 years old! Roland uses modeling in their SuperNatural EPs, and I don't like those as much as Nord's.

Nord does have experience in modeling (it's what they do for the organ), but that doesn't guarantee that they could model EPs any better than they could sample them. Modeling is actually trickier than sampling.

[Gambold]

The new enhancements have made a difference. Some of the samples are better than others. I only use the EP1, EP4, and EP5. They cover everything I need. The EP6 Sparkletop is interesting but it's a 60s Rhodes and I'd rather use a Wurli for that era. The Nefertiti 8 has a lot of followers here but I think it sounds murky. The other ones are not very distinctive, and I'd rather use the space for more acoustic pianos, which are Nord's true forte.

I think a lot of the complaints about Nord Rhodes samples are really complaints about the Fatar keybed, which is not the best for reproducing Rhodes sounds...at least not semi-weighted.

[anotherscott]

Fatar keybed, which is not the best for reproducing Rhodes sounds...at least not semi-weighted.

No semi-weighted is.

[maxpiano]

I miss the pedal squeak...

I have an old pedal that provides this effect...

I have a cheap one of mine that does too, the drummer always complains but now I can claim I do it to get a "true vintage sound"

With regards to the general question, my personal experience is that I like playing the Rhodes on the Nord Stage and the sound is good (more than) enough for most live and also recording situations, the new samples have added a little more liveliness, but the basic sound is the same for me (on NS2); when I want more I jump to Virtual Instruments, my favorites being Scarbee Mark I and Neosoul Keys (sampled) and GSI Mr Ray 73 (modeled).