Hamm C3 -> 5D organ simulation technical Qs

[Jorvic]

I'm looking to buy a 5D, trouble is the demo shops are a long distance away, my main concern would be how accurate the Hamm organ is. I have a Hamm C3 circa 1961, it's not perfect in tone but I know what to expect. If I were to buy a 5D the first things I would do is compare each single drawbar with my C3. I'd need to hear the key foldback on the higher notes as used on the top few drawbars, and also I notice the lower octave sounds very similar to the next one up. Add to that the Perc works in a specific first note priority type way, once the first note has "ponged" pressing further notes don't retrigger the circuit.

My C3 is very "spitty" as in key on key click, I'd be interested to hear just how well this is emulated in the 5D but also have a switch to turn it off. Key click seems ok in rock stuff but kills the mood in softer gospel/jazzy things.

And then just to make it more complex, I understand the 5D can be loaded with samples, so would it be possible for me to sample each tonewheel in my C3 and then upload to the 5D, from there the 5D does all the mixing using the drawbars.

A tad techincal.

thanks in advance
Jorvic

[Tracii]

The percussion works as in a real Hammond - it doesn't retrigger until you release the keys.

I can't say anything about the samples question, though I suspect the answer is no.

What I do know is that although I don't own a Hammond myself, I have played a few in the last couple of months (in every music store here in Berlin that has one on display) and they all sounded different - which is also what I read about old ones. So I doubt that the 5D will sound exactly like your Hammond, and I doubt that this is because of any lack of "accuracy" on Nord's part. It will simply be because the Hammond(s) they modelled their engine after sounded different than yours.

[Jorvic]

Thanks Tracii, indeed this is what I discover for myself, C3 chassis all seem to sound different. Mine being a 1961 model, I've had it serviced (new caps etc.) but it retains it's own tone, one that all other later C3 don't seem to have. Not saying that's a good or bad thing as my C3 isn't too "clean".

I think the only answer is for me to make the long journey to go try. If anyone knows about the uploading my own C3 into the 5D sound engine that would be good.

[analogika]

Every single Hammond sounds different. Even same-year models. Component tolerances at the time were enormous, so they all started out differently to begin with, and every single console has its own unique history and has aged differently.

Foldback works identically to the B3/C3.

Percussion works identically as well, and you get the option of original behaviour (which is to mute the 9th drawbar, since that is used on original consoles to trigger the percussion) or modified behaviour (9th drawbar is NOT muted when percussion is on — this is only available on modded consoles in "real life", e.g. Trek II percussion units).

The key click is adjustable.

You can NOT upload individual samples of all your drawbar partials or so and combine them. The Electro 5 will allow you a single layer of sample, layered or split with the piano or organ engine.

[fieldflower]

And to add to analogica's comment on sampling organ - just as the sample would be only one drawbar setting, it would also have perc on or off on every note - there's no way to get perc to work on only the first note pressed a'la actual Hammond.
Can sound good, but not as organic as the built-in organ emulation.

"Writing about sound is like dancing about architecture"
You should really go and try one out to see if it's Your cup of tea...

[maxpiano]

If max realism compared to “the King” is what you are looking for, then I think you should consider also a Crumar Mojo61 and/or a Viscount Legend Solo, together with the 5D, then decide.

PS: on the dual manual Mojo you can also load simulation parameters, obtained by measuring your own Hammond tonewheels, to get the sound closer to your specific one, not sure you can do the same on the 61 though

[anotherscott]

The fact that real B3s and such sound different from each other is why the Numa Organ 2 gives you 3 different Hammond models to choose from, and the Mojo 61 gives you somewhere around 20. It's a nice luxury... though of course anyone who owns the real thing only has the one.

[analogika]

The Electro 5D gives you three different “vintage” settings as well, along with various other parameters.

[anotherscott]

The Electro 5D gives you three different “vintage” settings as well, along with various other parameters.

...but they are all the same "model." The Vintage setting is essentially what those other boards do with Leakage/Crosstalk settings. They "age" the organ, but do not alter the fundamental character as the alternate organ models do.

[analogika]

True.

On the other hand, my B3 doesn’t give me the option of turning it into a different organ, either.

You’re kind of stuck with either liking the instrument, or selling/not buying it.