e-Piano problem

Gorantovic · Post by **Gorantovic** » 18 Mar 2017, 23:18

It is a problem of phase reversed signals betweel L and R channels and summing them to mono. Problem with E. Pianos is because they are sampled mono, and then the reverb is added. When you phase reverse one channel and sum both channels, all mono information is canceled and you only hear what is on "sides", that means stereo reverb. I had the exactly same problem on stage. Guys had one channel phase reversed accidentaly, and they put the same gain and faders on both channels, with pan pots both in center. Wurly didn't existed, only reverb aroubd it. I thought that something is wrong with NS, and it took me 10 minutes to realize what is all about.
In your case, the same happened with headphones. Usually there is a 1/8 to 1/4" original adapter which is not screwed all the way, and that happens.
Think in this way and you will find a solution.

Cheers!

Klimperkasten · Post by **Klimperkasten** » 19 Mar 2017, 13:27

Gorantovic wrote:It is a problem of phase reversed signals...

Hi Gorantovic,

I don't think that it is an adapter problem, because all other sounds are okay.

Klimperkasten · Post by **Klimperkasten** » 19 Mar 2017, 13:28

Jusrgen wrote:See the photo

Hi,

thank you! Are these the only lit LEDs when you select that program? Everything dark in the reverb or rotary section?

Jusrgen · Post by **Jusrgen** » 19 Mar 2017, 15:26

Hallo
The only Led is the "reverb-Stage1"

No "Rotary Led"

Post by **maxpiano** » 19 Mar 2017, 20:49

Klimperkasten wrote:
Gorantovic wrote:It is a problem of phase reversed signals...
Hi Gorantovic,

I don't think that it is an adapter problem, because all other sounds are okay.

I am afraid you are missing the main difference i.e why all other sounds don't show the same problem in that L/R phase cancellation condition, read twice and carefully what Pablo wrote (and also Gorantovic refers to):

(pablomastodon)The acoustic pianos, samples and synths do not suffer as severely from this as the EPs do, because they are stereo.

(Gorantovic)Problem with E. Pianos is because they are sampled mono

Have you tried to use different headphones and/or adapters?

Gorantovic · Post by **Gorantovic** » 19 Mar 2017, 23:16

Maxpiano, thank you for clarifying.

Wurly and Rhodes are mono instruments. They all have one output (except Suitcase piano, which has a preamp inserted, and circuit that sends that mono signal on two channels periodically, which we know as autopan, and create a virtual stereo image.
Wurly and all Rhodes samples on Nord are mono information sent to two channels. When you phase reverse one of them and sum them to mono, you get total cancelation.
Acoustic pianos are sampled with stereo micing patterns, which means that information in Left and Right channel is not the same. Because of that, this phase reversing and summing process won't cancel the sound, but it will create some new information that sounds like everything is ok, but it is not.
I don't know where is the problem, I only want to point out how to find it. If you want to know more about it, google search for "Mid Side processing".

All the best! We are here to help!

analogika · Post by **analogika** » 20 Mar 2017, 13:17

Gorantovic wrote: I don't know where is the problem, I only want to point out how to find it. If you want to know more about it, google search for "Mid Side processing".

Careful - mid/side-processing is a completely different thing that has nothing to do with the samples in this machine. It's a specific recording technique using a mono condenser mic set to figure-8 mode and positioned at 90° to the primary microphone to capture the stereo information, and it requires a specific decoder to turn the two recorded channels into a stereo signal.

None of the samples in the Nord are coded for M/S.

Gorantovic · Post by **Gorantovic** » 20 Mar 2017, 15:29

Analogika,

I didn't talk about Mid Side recording, that is different story. I only pointed on this way of thinking, only to inform himself what "Mid" is and what "Side" is, in terms of understanding this concept. In that way it will be easier to understand what is going on in general.

Post by **pablomastodon** » 21 Mar 2017, 18:46

Klimperkasten wrote:
Gorantovic wrote:It is a problem of phase reversed signals...
...I don't think that it is an adapter problem, because all other sounds are okay.

Kliperkasten,

In an earlier post you stated:

"Sorry, I ain't no professional musician, I'm rather a computer geek."

It is good of you to admit this and to seek advice from pro musicians and Nord experts. Why then are you reluctant to believe the advice you are given?

If you connect the main audio outputs of your instrument to any stereo input on a mixer (or two mono inputs panned hard left and hard right), you will not experience this problem. If you connect a pair of quality headphones with quality connectors you will not experience this problem. There is an irregularity in your headphone connection which is causing this. Period.

Bless, Pablo

Klimperkasten · Post by **Klimperkasten** » 01 Apr 2017, 17:20

Indeed, it was the headphone adapter.

Sorry about being reluctant of all your hints regarding phasing problems. After re-reading them, I took a cheap headphone and directly soldered a 1/4" plug to it, which brought me sparkling Rhodes.

I've tried with four different adapters, including the original one from my AKG headphones. They all have the same defect.

Once again: Thank you all very, very much for your hints!

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