This 'unofficial' Forum is dedicated to the Clavia Nord Keyboards, including the Nord Stage, Nord Electro and Nord Piano. Discuss any issues around Nord's keyboards, share your favorite patches, samples, and music. We are not affiliated with Clavia!
Two months ago I finally bought the NS2. After spending many days programming, and playing at live, I'm very happy with it. I've checked every sound available on the nord piano library. Really impressed ...however....I really don't like the Rhodes Samples....the are or two thin, or too dark, or the dynamics doesn't feel real...I was using a korg krome, with a really impressive rhodes. Also, my Kawai Mp6 has a kick ass rhodes sound...
So....I wonder...Which sample do you think is more real at live?
Eh ... I prefer the Wurly. The 2 amped. It cuts through the mix (jazz, lounge, world) much better, IMHO!
/Amicalement
Michael in Scania
NE3HP, NP88, NS2, DPP1, NL2X, NL2X, NLA1, NL4, NE5D, NW2 (Collect Them All?), some classic Rolands, Arturias, a Waldorf, a Kurz, a WONOK3, a pile of guitars, a P-bass, loopers, amps and computers ... I'm a gearslut!
I love the Sparkletop Rhodes, but a Rhodes ain't a Wurly.
The Wurly can bark.
/Amicalement
Michael in Scania
NE3HP, NP88, NS2, DPP1, NL2X, NL2X, NLA1, NL4, NE5D, NW2 (Collect Them All?), some classic Rolands, Arturias, a Waldorf, a Kurz, a WONOK3, a pile of guitars, a P-bass, loopers, amps and computers ... I'm a gearslut!
I am very much a modern piano man and my non-acoustic tool of choice is a Rhodes Suitcase 88. Sadly, I sold mine about 9 years ago when I "quit" gigging and stuck to straight piano. I got asked to play with a wicked band, couldn't wait to find a Suitcase/Clavinet and bought a Nord, which is a fantastic tool.
The Nord Rhodes sounds are lacking. The person who ordered the samples was not a Rhodes Jazzer, they were either into odd prog rock (Dyno piano nonsense), historical "kool" Lenny Kravitz style "sparkles coz it's vintage" pianos and various other bits and bobs. If you read the descriptions, you'll take their word for it that "We took a 1967 stage piano and optimised the hammers for a yadda and toned it to a blabla". You'd think they had sampled one....that's pretty much what the description would lead a normal customer to think. This is not the case....they are modelled and in that process, a lot of the nuances of the Rhodes has been lost....nuances that people like Scarbee and Gospel Keys or whatever the hell they are called capture. What we need is a bog standard suitcase piano recorded like they do with their Steinway Fat Lady, or whatever it's called. Every Rhodes I have set up with a screwdriver and my ear beats the hell out of the Nord. It's not their inability to sample things, it's the fact that they don't.
What we need is a straight up decent Rhodes. One I could set up right now with a few new rubber grommets, some new hammer tips, a screwdriver and a few hours. One which would tick box and sound great. Any Rhodes tinkerer would probably be able to do the same. With old gear, if you own it, you get to repair it when it breaks, which it does.
The Nord falls short, but it gains from being pretty good all around.
Where it majorly falls down is not having nearly enough velocity curves for the job. If you take an inadequate Rhodes sound like EPiano 1 and play it with a decent MIDI keyboard, it transforms it. I bought an unweighted keyboard to see if I could get a better clavinet and oddly enough, it made the Rhodes almost talk. Just like my actual Rhodes. Oddly enough, I also used to have a full hammond and I do not have a problem with the weighted keys of the Nord. The problem lies squarely with the lack of velocity.
Then there is the Rhodes Pan. The sine wave pan is virtually useless. The suitcase pan is a feature of the piano, as is the suitcase cab.
If you plug headphones into a Rhodes, you get a sound like EPiano 1. The cab makes the Rhodes sound. To the point that I'd never accept a free Stage Rhodes, as they are basically crap. The whole thing is about the speaker. Instead of giving us a suitcase cab, they give us some Roland Jazz Chorus, which is something I remember seeing in a Jazz Cafe with a guitarist using it. They got it with the wurly though. I reckon you don't need an amp sim, just as the acoustic pianos do not need a soundboard sim.
Nord aren't listening. I imagine they are looking at this forum and noticing what the themes are, with regards to gripes with their instruments. No +/-12 pitch bend, no flashy leds for the leslie on the 2, no suitcase pan, no velocity curves, not enough memory, etc, etc, etc.
They plainly aren't going to do anything about it, apart from meter out a little bit more to gradually entice people to replace their instruments. Accept it for what it is, compromised. The Rhodes is pretty good, but it's lacking and they aren't going to sort it out......yet.
If you want one, you have to first find a decent one. When you find a decent one, you won't want to trash it gigging it. You'll have to deal with spares, dud pickups, mucking about trying to get the tone right.....re-tipping it every now and then....not being able to press a button and get a synth.
I used to gig a combination of Hammond/Leslie, Rhodes Suitcase, Wurly 200a, Clavinet D6 and a Minimoog. I will stick my neck out and say I wouldn't want them back in return for the Nord, as the Nord does not have hassle for moving it. I can remember one-manning the top of my Rhodes 88 up some steps.....not a job for an older man.
They could get it so much better though.
Don't hold your breath.
These users thanked the author jazzystu for the post:
jazzystu wrote: The person who ordered the samples was not a Rhodes Jazzer, they were either into odd prog rock (Dyno piano nonsense)
As far as I can recall, Rhodes is quite rare in prog rock, and I don't think I"ve ever heard Dyno there. Genesis, Yes, ELP, etc... almost no Rhodes. Can you give some examples of what you're talking about?
jazzystu wrote: You'd think they had sampled one....that's pretty much what the description would lead a normal customer to think. This is not the case....they are modelled and in that process, a lot of the nuances of the Rhodes has been lost....It's not their inability to sample things, it's the fact that they don't.
Nord organs are modeled, but their EPs are sampled. No modeling.
jazzystu wrote: If you plug headphones into a Rhodes, you get a sound like EPiano 1. The cab makes the Rhodes sound. To the point that I'd never accept a free Stage Rhodes, as they are basically crap. The whole thing is about the speaker.
That's just the Rhodes sound *you* like. The Stage models are equally viable. Many (probably most) recorded and touring Rhodes were stage models or taken from direct outs, rather than mic'ing up the speakers in the Suitcase.
These users thanked the author anotherscott for the post:
One of the nice things about the NS2 is the ability to do a lot of tweaking. I mostly use two EP programs that are optimized specifically to cut through the mix, using splits with different EQ and Drive settings on each side, plus some synth section tricks.
The first one uses the EP2 sample, but EQed to achieve a completely different tone compared to the raw sample, and to fix its thinness starting an octave above middle C. It seems to fit into almost every song I play. The high-frequency boost adds some noise, but usually that's not too much of a problem.
The second one uses the EP7 sample, which, IMHO, is the best-sounding EP but has some annoying mid-range resonance that quickly turns into mud in a mix. So I have made a strong mid-range cut and then added some of it back in using the synth section. I still do a lot of tweaking on this program.
Hi
that is true, if you just play the nord Rhodes sound in a context of a popfunkhouse whatever band it works to warm up the whole thing without taking to much room. But if you want to play it more like a soloinstrument or in an acoustic band context I am not happy with it. Because Rhodes is my main sound I stay with my Kronos, totally different Rhodes world. If I would find a simular rhodes soundquality in a nordstage I would by one, because I like otherwise the concept of the nord stage (before Kronos I played a stage classic).
AnotherScott and Pablomastadon, can I ask you (a straight question which should have a straight answer).
Do either of you do paid work for Nord, whether it be paid in free gear, or by them?
I note a theme in your comments and I'm just curious. I remember a discussion (in the archive) about Rhodes sounds and both of you continue to jump to their defence.
I'm curious why this is the case, the occam's razor reason would be that you are some way employed by them.
...however....I really don't like the Rhodes Samples....the are or two thin, or too dark, or the dynamics doesn't feel real...I was using a korg krome, with a really impressive rhodes. Also, my Kawai Mp6 has a kick ass rhodes sound...
