Tool for Converting Stage Programs to Stage 4 Format

[Nord at Night]

Another post made me think a little about this so I thought I would begin a post on it; hopefully the Nord folks are checking in.

With the new Stage 4 structure allowing creation of piano, organ, and synth presets with their effects, I could see a tool being developed that could take an earlier-model Stage program and break it up into 2 organ and 2 piano presets with the effects assigned, approximate the 2 synth presets with effects as a starting point, and combine all into a Stage 4 program. The old Panel A could be one Scene Layer and Panel B the other, or the user could opt to have all in one Scene Layer if the Panels in the original are combined. If Nord created such a tool, it could even be developed to interface with your Stage keyboard, let you highlight the programs you want converted to Stage 4 format, and then create programs/presets individually or output a bundle that includes the programs, presets, and even the samples used converted to NSMP4 format (if "user-created"). Pianos would be set to use the new versions and Programs using Nord NSMP or NSMP3 samples would be set to use the newer NSMP4 samples in the Stage 4 or convert where new ones aren't available.

Given comments so far on the NS4 cost and whether it's worth it to go through the hours and hours of programming work again with a new model, I'm sure having such a tool could sway quite a few current owners on the fence about the NS4 who may have the funds but don't want to have to go through all of the work of programming again. A NS4 program tool could at least cut the time in half with the synth-related programs being the only ones really needing work after conversion. Fingers crossed.

[Nord33]

Seems like a pretty nice idea. There is probably no need for A&B from S3 to different layer scenes on S4, but only A&B from S3 to A&B engines on S4 as it has those. Synth C would be the only one "unassigned", but as you said, that already does half of the work if not more.

[florence]

yes great idea.

[dream=ON]
Could even be included in the Nord Sound Manager, when connected to NS4, import program/bundle from NS3 and magic it convert it to NS4...
[dream=OFF]

now wondering if a 100% conversion will be possible. From NS2 to NS3 the Synth section was already different, example FM quite impossible to translate...

[maxpiano]

yes great idea.

[dream=ON]
Could even be included in the Nord Sound Manager, when connected to NS4, import program/bundle from NS3 and magic it convert it to NS4...
[dream=OFF]

now wondering if a 100% conversion will be possible. From NS2 to NS3 the Synth section was already different, example FM quite impossible to translate...

I think any mapping will necessarily have compromises and they will have to be made explicit to the user, so that it will be clear that conversion will only be approximate, not to expect an identical results and that the converted patch needs to be checked/modified after.

[florence]

yes right, would be starting point only. But question is will Nord put time and resource for such feature? Was never the case in the past...

[hernjov1]

Most definitely a great idea, and would sway many to purchase the NS4! I like many Nord folks boughts the NS3 to use as one board on stage down sizing my rig to save time & my back roading gear! Problem is time spent programming if my board goes down. I need a backup board quicky! I'm now leaning toward another NS3 purchase for that very reason! I could dump sounds from one to board the other, and BAMB! If I had such a tool to accomplish transfers. I would buy the NS4 for my main board, and NS3 as the backup! Would love to talk to the marketing folks @ Clavia! It would be a win win situation for both sides! Seller & Buyers...Nords are beautiful machines to work with, but for the ticket price of them. Clavia should be on the ball to making their new flagship that much more attractive!

[anotherscott]

yes right, would be starting point only. But question is will Nord put time and resource for such feature? Was never the case in the past...

Yeah, they've never done it before, even when the fundamental architecture of the board was much more similar (i.e. two slots of sounds, each with a piano, an organ, and a synth), so I doubt they'd do it now, even though the effort people have put it their old patches is something that stops people from upgrading, and even something "in the ballpark" would be a great time-saver. Maybe Nord feels that the resources required (e.g. having to hire another programmer to do it) would cost them more than the incremental sales they would get, especially if they know that the final result would indeed be something only very roughly in the ballpark, and so they also know they would get a lot of complaints about what a bad job it did, further reducing the potential upside of those increased sales.

[maxpiano]

yes right, would be starting point only. But question is will Nord put time and resource for such feature? Was never the case in the past...

Yeah, they've never done it before, even when the fundamental architecture of the board was much more similar (i.e. two slots of sounds, each with a piano, an organ, and a synth), so I doubt they'd do it now, even though the effort people have put it their old patches is something that stops people from upgrading, and even something "in the ballpark" would be a great time-saver. Maybe Nord feels that the resources required (e.g. having to hire another programmer to do it) would cost them more than the incremental sales they would get, especially if they know that the final result would indeed be something only very roughly in the ballpark, and so they also know they would get a lot of complaints about what a bad job it did, further reducing the potential upside of those increased sales.

I share the same view with @anotherscott and let's remember that also for other brands like Yamaha (and maybe also Korg) conversion tools were initially an independent external SW developer initiative; it would be enough if Nord would make the structure of their Program files and/or Sysex public (what @florence had to reverse engineer by himself instead, while other companies often include that in the MIDI Implementation specs) then the responsibility of the conversion tool would be left on the potential developer, even if with some risk for the brand also in this case (in fact also for the NS2/3 Program Viewer Clavia asked @florence to put a disclaimer statement on the File Viewer for Nord Stage website)

[florence]

agree... now 3rd party software would be a simple option if really ALL parameters are documented Sysex... Reverse eng file format is not really sustainable at long term, even if I spent really lot of time for the previous iteration. And would not be ready when users really need it, aka in the short coming months... So only Nord can provide something, and could be very, very simple for them...

[cookie]

I'm very pessimistic.
I've seen Nord's feedback and "help" on the Nord Stage File Viewer program. That could have been a great opportunity to come up with new features in NSM or other tools, but unfortunately, the small company doesn't bother with that.
Fred