Nord User Forum

I finally got my AUX KB working with our NS4 and am now able to control individual layers from an AUX KB (in this case, I’m using my [url]Arturia Keylab 49 Essential[/https://www.musiciansfriend.com/keyboar ... ZIQAvD_BwE]).

Things that are working:

— all keys, obviously
— all pads
— CHORD, TRANS, OCT-, OCT+
— Pitchwheel

Things that are working, but are weird (and for reference, I’ve got it set to control "Synth A—“)
— Param 2 controls ORGAN FLUTE8 4’
— Param 3 controls ORGAN OBOE8 2’
— Param 4 controls ORGAN BASS16 16’
— and the knob above the Master volume controls ORGAN STR 16 8’
— Release/CH4 slider somehow controls the PIANO layers (0% is A only, 50% is B only, and 100% is A+B)
— Attack/CH5 does the same with ORGAN layers ( so again 0% is A only, 50% is B only, and 100% is A+B)
— Sustain/CH7 does something chaotic with the stops, CHORUS, and PERCUSSION sections that somehow doesn’t seem to have a sonic effect

Parameter 1 is functionless, as are Attack/CH1, Decay/CH2, Sustain/CH3 and the Mod wheel doesn’t seem to control anything.

Anyone had a similar experience? Furthermore, does anyone know how to map or assign these controls so that they are actually of use? Would especially love to be able to control layer volume from the KeyLab.

Thanks for any help you can offer!

Well, MIDI isn't plug-and-play as USB may be.

So, you can control a lot of settings, and you can control them by a lot of controllers - but not out of the box. The latter works only for a few commands that are almost always the same: Sustain, Expression, and a few other.

Besides, you will need to learn some MIDI grammar to make your gear talk one to another (classical MIDI is unidirect).

There's a list of controller command numbers for the Stage 4 (at the and of the manual) that you would need to match with the knobs and buttons you want to use on your Arturia. As you can't change the controller numbers on the Stage 4, you'd need to change the commands that are sent from the pads and buttons on the external keyboard.

I wouldn't do it - you have everything at hand on your Nord. But you should be able to reprogram the Arturia if you want.

Doing the same setup here (NS4 + Arturia Keylab 61 Mk1). Had an issue were dialing through the presets did a reset of AUX KB setting but magically this morning everything worked all fine… Don’t know what I did wrong NS4 with all the layering options, hands on controller and quality cut through sounds has abandoned my MacBook/Mainstage Rig finally! Amazing flexibility and stability for live performances!

christree wrote: ↑13 Jun 2024, 09:05 Doing the same setup here (NS4 + Arturia Keylab 61 Mk1). Had an issue were dialing through the presets did a reset of AUX KB setting but magically this morning everything worked all fine… Don’t know what I did wrong NS4 with all the layering options, hands on controller and quality cut through sounds has abandoned my MacBook/Mainstage Rig finally! Amazing flexibility and stability for live performances!

Out of curiosity: when you say ”everything worked fine” what does this actually mean? Can you use wheel, aftertouch, exp pedal with Keylab controllig NS4? What exactly can you control?

I just installed the update and I was able to verify that AUX KB still does not receive the midi ccs of: aftertouch, modulation wheel, cutoff and resonance of the synth section, on/off vib/chorus and on/off percussion of the organ section; Unfortunately the midi problems I was hoping for have not yet been resolved, nothing has changed.

Satomy wrote: ↑14 Jun 2024, 15:14 I just installed the update and I was able to verify that AUX KB still does not receive the midi ccs of: aftertouch, modulation wheel, cutoff and resonance of the synth section, on/off vib/chorus and on/off percussion of the organ section; Unfortunately the midi problems I was hoping for have not yet been resolved, nothing has changed.

So unfortunately aux kb mode is still broken…

Similar stuff in another thread I posted without seeing this one... Aux KB is super useful but has its limitations as shown here.

I really wish Clavia could release a firmware update (if no hardware modifications would be necessary) or a Stage 4ex at some point that had:
-independent midi channel assignable control of any/each panel a la the Nord Stage 2 midi architecture.
-the ability to have a panel active but turn local keyboard notes for any panel "off" and only control via a separate midi channel from an external keyboard a la the Nord Stage 2 midi architecture.

Each separate instrument "panel" controlled only from the ext keyboard (no internal triggering of notes from NS4 keyed) should be able to:
-transpose incoming midi notes from an unaltered external keyboard to match transpose function settings on the NS4. (I'm wondering if this is currently provided in the NS4 midi architecture or not...)
-Allow octave shift set on the NS4 to alter incoming midi notes up/down an octave or two so octave settings for each panel controlled by an external kb could be program based and not have to alter an external keyboard's octave/layer/zone settings ever. (This did not work in the NS2 and forced the external midi controller to have to set individual octave +1, -1, etc for each separate midi channel to get a piano -1 octave on midi ch 2, an organ to be +1 octave on midi ch 3, and a synth to be +0 on ch4.)
-Allow zones in a kb split that were set on the NS4 (not on the ext keyboard) for individual instrument "panels" controlled only by an ext keyboard to filter incoming midi notes so splits could be programmed solely on the NS4 without altering the zones/splits on the ext keyboard. (This also did not work in the NS2 and forced the external midi controller to have to set individual zones for each separate midi channel to get a piano on E1-E7 on midi ch 2, an organ to be E3-E7 on midi ch 3, and a synth to be E2-E7 on midi ch4.)
-listen to aftertouch commands from individual external midi channels in either the morph global settings or in the synth section. (This was possible on the NS2!)
-listen to control pedal and sustain pedal midi info (this exists and was possible on the NS2 but we want to make sure it doesn't get taken away!!) from the ext keyboard.

The goal would be to have the NS4 be the only place that knob turning, fader sliding, morph settings, etc would be adjusted from and the other midi keyboard could just be set up to send midi on a few channels for specific instrument panels (not from the NS4 keyboard). It makes a super simple, robust, reliable, and versatile live rig for just about any musician. SW keybed and all controls on top, weighted keys on the bottom of your choosing. If you are back lining, just about any weighted midi controller will do the job if it can send a few channels of midi. you always have the same physical control interface to work with on the top (easily visible/accessible) board and all of your programs could remain unchanged between gigs...

Midi rant over. Hopefully Clavia can figure this out for me (us) ))

Satomy wrote: ↑14 Jun 2024, 15:14 I just installed the update and I was able to verify that AUX KB still does not receive the midi ccs of: aftertouch, modulation wheel, cutoff and resonance of the synth section, on/off vib/chorus and on/off percussion of the organ section; Unfortunately the midi problems I was hoping for have not yet been resolved, nothing has changed.

As in, the NS4 does not "hear" the aux kb's aftertouch, mod wheel, or control pedal midi cc when a function is morphed to those cc commands?

I'm coming in a bit late here but are all of the cc commands you mention are not being received correctly mapped to the corresponding midi cc channel # on the aux keyboard? Are there aux keyboard settings for aftertouch, mod wheel, and exp pedal enable? I don't have my NS4 yet (maybe will not buy one unless it can do some things that we have been asking for!!)

Page 66 of the manual linked below has all of the cc channels listed out.
https://www.nordkeyboards.com/wt/docume ... tion-K.pdf

aftertouch (not listed in the manual but generally a setting that can be transmitted along with note information
modulation wheel, (not listed in the manual but generally goes on cc # 1??)
expression - cc# (Global) 11
(FILTER) cutoff cc#59 (NOTE THIS IS ACTUALLY CALLED "SYNTH FILTER FREQ")
(FILTER) resonance cc#60
on/off vib/chorus = cc# 2:20 (NOTE THIS IS A NRPN command consisting of a MSB and a LSB #.... complicated!)
on/off percussion = cc# 2:18 (NOTE THIS IS A NRPN command consisting of a MSB and a LSB #.... complicated!)

HI.
I am writing to those like me who have MIDI management problems with the Nord Stage 4. I have partially solved them.
I was waiting for an update that would solve the MIDI problems of the NS4, but even with the latest (disappointing) update 1.30, nothing has changed.
I had the NS2 which in my opinion was perfect in MIDI management. Then I got the NS3 and the MIDI was disappointing. The NS4 remains the worst of all.
Instead of moving forward, midi has become unmanageable in Live situations.
My need was to pair a Nord Wave 2 and an M-Audio Keystation 61, an Nord Stage 4. Even accepting the compromise of sacrificing one of the synths of the NS4, to manage the program change of the NW2, I needed the NW2 also became a master to pilot the NS4. This was impossible, because if the NW2 is considered an EX KEY, it cannot receive program changes on the same channel. If the NW2 had the ability to assign a CH MIDI IN different from the CH MIDI out, the problems would have been fewer.
My NS4 has the MIDI CHs set up like this: Global CH15 - Aux KB CH9 - Organ CH A CH7 - Organ CH B CH 8 - Piano Channel A CH 2 - Piano Channel B CH 3 - Synth Channel A CH 4 -Synth Channel B CH 5 -Synth Channel C CH 6 -External CH A CH 1 - External CH B CH 16 - External CH C CH 11. The NORD WAVE 2 has assigned these MIDI CHs. Global Channel CH 9 - Layer A CH 10 - Layer B CH 11 - Layer C CH 13 - Layer D CH 14, and like EX SYNTH, is controlled by Synth C of the HNS4. To avoid the conflict between Ex Keys, as described above, I used the Event Processor of the Midi Solution, so that the program change messages coming from the Nord Stage on CH MIDI 11 were converted to CH MIDI 9. Here is the map:

F0 00 00 50 28 02 00 00 02 00 7F 02 02 00 7F F7
CA 00
C8 00
{ Setting #1: Map all Program Change events on MIDI channel 11 to Program Change events on MIDI channel 9, with the incoming Program Change value mapped to the outgoing Program Change number. Continue to process settings (control-click to edit) }

F0 00 00 50 28 02 01 01 03 00 7F 03 03 00 7F F7
BA 00 00
B8 00 00
{ Setting #2: Map all Control Change #0 events on MIDI channel 11 to Control Change #0 events on MIDI channel 9, with the incoming value mapped to the outgoing Control Change value. Continue to process settings (control-click to edit) }

F0 00 00 50 28 02 02 01 03 00 7F 03 03 00 7F F7
BA 20 00
B8 20 00
{ Setting #3: Map all Control Change #32 events on MIDI channel 11 to Control Change #32 events on MIDI channel 9, with the incoming value mapped to the outgoing Control Change value. Continue to process settings (control-click to edit) }

At this point it all worked, and I repeat, if the NORD WAVE had had the possibility of having the MIDI IN on a different channel from the MIDI OUT, this step could have been avoided.
I then connected the MIDI OUT of the NORD STAGE, of the NORD WAVE, and of the M-AUDIO KEYSTATION which drives one of the other sections of the NORD STAGE, to the MIDI MERGER (4 in - 2 out) of the Midi Solutions, and the out of the Merger in the MIDI IN of a thru box, where OUT 1 goes to NORD STAGE and OUT 2 to NORD WAVE. Put the NORD STAGE in LOCAL OFF. Now the internal synths are as if they were in LOCAL OFF, and the NORD STAGE, the NORD WAVE and the KEYSTATION are external Masters, with the NORD WAVE external synth also receiving Program Changes.

I hope it can be useful to someone.
Sorry for my bad English. I wrote in Italian and used a translator.

GpKey wrote: ↑17 Jun 2024, 09:30 Instead of moving forward, midi has become unmanageable in Live situations.
My need was to pair a Nord Wave 2 and an M-Audio Keystation 61, an Nord Stage 4. Even accepting the compromise of sacrificing one of the synths of the NS4, to manage the program change of the NW2, I needed the NW2 also became a master to pilot the NS4. This was impossible, because if the NW2 is considered an EX KEY, it cannot receive program changes on the same channel.

This is terrible that with NS4 users need to be ”midi professionals” using all kind of gear and/or midi programming to make it work like previous Stage models.

One thing is again not very well thought from Clavia: using ext mode for synth a/b/c shuts off corresponding synth. It ”sacrifices” a synth like @GpKey put it. I’ve said that this is clear waste of multitimbral power and I cannot understand why they decided to do it that way. In fact first firmwares of NS4 did not shut off corresponding synth if you put it to ext mode. And for synth this was even kind of ”local off / no keyboard zone”. I could have even lived with this way (of course this ”local off” was just for synths). So the whole midi history of NS4 is a complete mess and one step ahead and two steps back. To me only clear step forward was that they finaly managed to fix midi clock sync.