Nord Stage 3 - hammond B3 Sound

[Quai34]

Ok, thanks, finally, for me, it doesn't matter because I I didn't know that the Reverb was before the Leslie on my C2 but I like it as it is as well as the Stage 2 so....On a real B3, the Reverb is before? I can't remember how it was with my L100, I'm assuming before the Leslie because it was a spring Reverb inside the L100 right?
By the way, if on the C2 the Reverb is before the Leslie like in a real B3, if I buy a Neo Vent, the only way to have it after the Leslie is to turn down completely the internal Reverb and to add an external effect like a TC hall of fame or whatever right?

[anotherscott]

On a real B3, the Reverb is before?

A real B3 does not have reverb, though some other Hammond models did. Also, some Leslie models had reverb. If you are trying to recreate the sound of a Hammond or a Leslie that has a spring reverb unit in it, your reverb needs to be before the rotary effect. But that is not an especially common Hammond/Leslie sound, since most Hammonds and Leslies don't have reverbs.

The Leslie itself is a speaker in a room, it is impossible to put reverb after a Leslie, unless you mic it up, and process the microphone sound through a reverb, which has certainly been done on recordings, and can be done in live performance in bigger venues where you are mic'ing up the Leslie to put it through a FOH (PA) system.

For the most part, in a live in-the-room performance, the only "reverb" is the natural reflections of whatever room you happen to be playing in.

[cgrafx]

Actually Leslie models with Reverb in them had a separate reverb amp and speaker and was not routed through the rotating baffles. I believe all the "R" models like 122R had reverb effectively after the Leslie.

Hammond organs with internal Reverb on the other hand, would have added reverb to the signal chain going to the Leslie and that would put it pre-leslie.

[anotherscott]

Actually Leslie models with Reverb in them had a separate reverb amp and speaker and was not routed through the rotating baffles. I believe all the "R" models like 122R had reverb effectively after the Leslie.

Hammond organs with internal Reverb on the other hand, would have added reverb to the signal chain going to the Leslie and that would put it pre-leslie.

Ah, I didn't realize the Leslies that had reverbs actually routed the reverb'd signal to its own speaker! Thanks for the correction. So in that case, in effect, the reverb is neither before nor after the rotary speaker... instead you hear a non-rotary version with reverb AND a rotary effect without reverb, mixing in the room, interesting!

[Quai34]

So, on a C2, with the Reverb before the Leslie, it is the closest thing to a B3, well kind of, because the Reverb should be the room?
So, why on the Stage 2 it is after? Just because it was a common Reverb for the all 3 engines?
And why people ask to get a Reverb after the Leslie on the Stage 3 if it isn't the real thing is?

[anotherscott]

And why people ask to get a Reverb after the Leslie on the Stage 3 if it isn't the real thing is?

Well for one thing, I would guess that more people are familiar with the sound of Hammonds as they appear on recordings (something everyone has heard) as opposed to what real tonewheel Hammonds sound like (because not as many people have had the opportunity to play real ones). On recordings, the Leslie has to be mic'd up, and reverb may be added in the mix, so it could sound reverb'd on the recording even though it would not have sounded that way live in the room. (There are also room reflections in the room, but you also get room reflections playing your speakers in a room.)

[Quai34]

Ok, good point, thanks

[RichardG]

It all depends how you perceive 'reverb'.
For me personally it's what happens after the sound has left the speaker.
Same for delay.

If you think of it as an 'effect' (like chorus) then it's before the speaker.
That's my reason for the request to Clavia to make it selectable (before or after Leslie) to be able to use either view.

And what is 'original' or historically correct is not always what you want in a certain situation.
Say you have organ and piano with a lot of reverb for the piano, the organ (with Leslie) will make it sound like everything is run through a phaser.
Back in the day (if you'd like the historical correctness) you wouldn't run the piano through the Leslie as well.
That's mainly what I don't like about this configuration.
In the NS2 this was much less prolific (did an A/B when I still had both).

[analogika]

Actually Leslie models with Reverb in them had a separate reverb amp and speaker and was not routed through the rotating baffles. I believe all the "R" models like 122R had reverb effectively after the Leslie.

Hammond organs with internal Reverb on the other hand, would have added reverb to the signal chain going to the Leslie and that would put it pre-leslie.

The 122R does not have any extra speakers. It merely has circuitry that allows installation of a spring reverb into the case. It is still routed to the regular rotor and horn assemblies.

My B3 and A100 have/had (the A100 was destroyed in a fire) spring reverb kits installed.

The default on any classic Hammond is to have the reverb routed through the Leslie.

[brane]

The default on any classic Hammond is to have the reverb routed through the Leslie.

I LIKE the reverb routed through the Leslie - must for Jon Lord & K. Emerson crazy effects