Nord User Forum

happykomusic wrote:Hey we figured out a way to make the Nords have vocoding. The options are a tad limited but this way does work. The link below is a YouTube video on how to do it!

I figured the tone was meant to be funny. Not my style, but then my sense of humour occasionally bombs in a grandiose way, too, so I'll give you that.

I honestly wasn't sure whether the content was intended in the same tongue-in-cheek vein.

A ring modulator applied to a vocal sample has absolutely nothing in common with a vocoder. They don't even sound remotely alike, and the whole point of a vocoder — having a carrier signal that behaves like a completely different signal, but doesn't sound like that signal — is missed entirely.

It's a neat trick, sure, and it would make for a fun tutorial in its own right, but it just has Nothing. To. Do. With. Vocoding.

Elias wrote:

happykomusic wrote:vocoder tutorial

This pretty much has nothing to do with a vocoder tho?... A vocoder is a filter bank that roughly follows the modulator signal (microphone).

Please see the link below for the dictionary definition of a "vocoder" below.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/vocoder

happykomusic wrote:

Elias wrote:

happykomusic wrote:vocoder tutorial

This pretty much has nothing to do with a vocoder tho?... A vocoder is a filter bank that roughly follows the modulator signal (microphone).

Please see the link below for the dictionary definition of a "vocoder" below.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/vocoder

Penguin: aquatic animal that lays eggs.

A definition that isn't wrong, but applies to a huge number of completely unrelated things, entirely misses the point of what makes a penguin a penguin, and is totally misleading in a fundamental way.

Sorry, but — no.

happykomusic wrote:

Elias wrote:

happykomusic wrote:vocoder tutorial

This pretty much has nothing to do with a vocoder tho?... A vocoder is a filter bank that roughly follows the modulator signal (microphone).

Please see the link below for the dictionary definition of a "vocoder" below.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/vocoder

Changing dictionary

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dicti ... sh/vocoder

or, for more info

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vocoder

maxpiano wrote:

happykomusic wrote:

Elias wrote: This pretty much has nothing to do with a vocoder tho?... A vocoder is a filter bank that roughly follows the modulator signal (microphone).

Please see the link below for the dictionary definition of a "vocoder" below.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/vocoder

Changing dictionary

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dicti ... sh/vocoder

Phew. That's not quite right, either, and even worse, the definition actually fits the way happyko is applying ring modulation to the vocal sample.

A vocoder actually reads the frequency profile of one signal and applies it to another. Think of it as a signal (modulator, or analysis) being read through a graphic equaliser, and the vocoder applying those values on the graphic EQ of another signal (carrier), in real time. There is no requirement for the modulator to be a voice, nor is the modulator used "as an oscillator".

The great thing here is that happyko really doesn't care. He is basically a troll with some information content. While this video completely misses the mark IMO and lands in the thickets of total misinformation, his Nord Stage 3, er, "review" is pretty hilarious:

his Nord Stage 3, er, "review" is pretty hilarious:

I guess, as you said, it depends on your sense of humor-

-dj

As stated earlier here, the two dictionary definitions of a vocoder are equivalent to: "Submarine - A kind of boat". There is almost some truth, but no actually useful (or truthful) information is provided.

BTW @happykomusic, don't take all of this too harshly. You are not the only one using these terms loosely.

But here is a definition that I would approve of (whether or not anyone cares):
A vocoder is a subtractive synthesizer that combines the tonal characteristics (or timbre) of one signal with the pitches of another. The most common use is the combination of a human voice and a musical keyboard with the result roughly resembling a choir.

Sorry @analogika and @Elias but I don’t fully agree, while dictionaries definitions can be partial or limited, there should be little doubt about the fact that vocoder as term comes from the merge of “voice” and “encoder”, as it relates to the original “non musical” version of it (which is why I also attached the Wikipedia link, the history of this tool is important to define what it is and also why it is called like that).

So I see it the opposite way: a vocoder is not a generic synthesizer mixing two sources, it is an audio processor which is originally intended to alter a human voice, in a specific way (encode); then of course it can be creatively used also with other sound sources but that doesn’t change its nature. For sure a Ring Modulator is not a vocoder, as well.

maxpiano wrote:So I see it the opposite way: a vocoder is not a generic synthesizer mixing two sources, it is an audio processor which is originally intended to alter a human voice, in a specific way (encode); then of course it can be creatively used also with other sound sources but that doesn’t change its nature. For sure a Ring Modulator is not a vocoder, as well.

Exactly.

The vocoder is not a synthesizer. It is the unit that processes the carrier using the characteristics of the modulator. SOME machines, like the Korg VC-10 and the Roland VP-330, had built-in organ or string engines to use as carrier, but the vocoder itself is just the processor built into the same box, not the sound source.

It does work subtractively, though.

Both modulator and carrier can be synths, drums, voice, or any other audio signal. It's fairly common to use a drum signal to modulate a synth pad carrier, for example.

One of the most famous examples here in Germany was the intro to "Raumpatrouille Orion" by Peter Thomas, where a voice was used to modulate a cello carrier. Nothing synthetic.

The vocoders I was mainly referring to vocoders of this nature: https://youtu.be/wgRT3U2nW5M. Meaning these band pass filter banks, with individual envelope followers. Of course this might be an unnecessarily narrow definition.

Maybe I'll break the unspoken rules of the internet and admit that a statement I made in the past was not flawless, and that maybe a contrary view is also respectable.

PS. there are numerous terms here that are losely defined, like "synthetic", which it all the more complicated... Language, am I right?