Nord User Forum

>Or you work for a competing brand<

Haha, OMG, seriously? Someone says something not totally glowing about Clavia and they could be a Korg shill?

Putting aside the extreme self-importance of that view (as in, Yamaha or Roland could possibly give a rat's rump what is said here)...does anyone really think that any company would pay anyone to go onto a forum of a boutique keyboard manufacturer, pretend they are an outraged customer, all with the dire hope of drumming up sales for their own brand? Are the Christmas projections for Kawai so bleak that this is the Evil Plan they concocted in marketing?

Ground control to Major Tom...

I will also say that all these problems with the Stage 3 are exactly why you DON'T order expensive keyboards from Europe if you live in the States, because if you need to return them, it's an expensive frightmare. This came up a few months ago when it became apparent that the USA was gonna have to wait (and in some cases still is) to buy one.

kbrkr wrote:I back the OP 100%. I'm on the fence about returning my NS3C. Other than Ergonomics, there is nothing in this board that is wowing me. My Kronos blows it away. I wanted something lighter and more tweakable live.

Whether the organ and piano sounds are better in Nord or Kronos is subjective. But yeah, the big advantage of the Nord is the ergonomics. Weight/knobiness aside, the Kronos is generally more capable overall. Kronos actually has a better interface for patch recall, but Nord has the better interface for patch creation and real-time tweakability. But no one board gives you everything. An NS3 73 plus a Kronos 61 would be pretty nice. Bu if you prefer the Kronos piano/organ to Nord's, maybe a Kronos 61 plus a Nord Lead A1 would give you what you're really after, since the synth section is your favorite part of the NS3C, and where real-time tweakability plays the biggest part.

>Nord would be much better served by just letting everybody know what is going on.<

That would be nice but it's not workable for a company to "let everyone know" day-to-day planning and engineering issues. Try to imagine Yamaha responding to emails complaining about a product, or posting regular missives about "what's going on."

Clavia may be small but they are still a manufacturing company, and as such any and all decisions about their product lines go through extensive development and review. Announcements about upgrades or patches have to be made very carefully and very rarely, to promote stability in their customer base. They don't want a website or a user's forum riddled with corporate apologies, mea culpas, or hang-on-we're-fixing-its.

In short, There isn't going to be a Sarah Huckabee Sanders of Clavia answering your daily questions on why this widget doesn't work the way you want it to.

>If you put a "contact us" link on your website and a customer uses it - they deserve a timely response.<

I tend to agree on this, however. Although I'm not surprised you don't hear anything - European companies in general, and Clavia in specific, are hardly renown for customer service. Here in the States, where capitalism is king, customer service is everything and makes or breaks a company. Very few institutions can get away with ignoring their customers, because there's always a competitor ready to snatch them up.

Clavia has their niche, they make the money they need, and don't seem too concerned with either expanding their market share or losing it. So - the Contact Us was just part of the website template, sorry...

brane wrote:

harmonizer wrote:

Jonnie Cache wrote:.....Let's see... You bought the Nord knowing there was no sample editor released yet. I think that one is on you......

I would respectfully disagree with this statement. Here is the Nord product announcement, posted in April or May (I am not sure whether the date "05-04-2017" I read in the USA has been translated to US date format or not). Here it is:
http://www.nordkeyboards.com/about-us/i ... rd-stage-3

"...it is even possible to create and transfer your own samples using the Nord Sample Editor. "

The statement in the Nord announcement could not be any more clear.

Me to (disagree with Jonnie Cache statement) - see my post at nearly same time:
http://www.norduserforum.com/nord-stage ... tml#p92876

For what it's worth, the online document that is referenced contains a typical disclaimer you will find on promotional materials that reads, "All specifications are subject to change without further notice." Also the Nord Sample Editor page on the website has consistently indicated that the Editor for the NS3 is not yet available. It currently reads, "An updated version of the Nord Sample Editor adding compatibility for the Nord Stage 3 is in the works and will be released soon. Stay tuned."
http://www.nordkeyboards.com/software-t ... ple-editor

That being said, the initial message (at least the first one I saw) from Nord was, "An updated version of the Nord Sample Editor adding compatibility for the Nord Stage 3 will be released late summer 2017."
https://web.archive.org/web/20170704070 ... ple-editor

Caveats aside, expectations were set that the editor would be available by now, so the irritation is understandable, although IMHO the delay is still within reason. The NS3 is my first Nord, so I still have lots to explore and learn before I even get close to having the Panel, Organ and Sample Editor issues become meaningful. It is fair to say, however, if I was in the same shoes as those who upgraded from an NS2/EX and lost functionality, I would probably be actively voicing my concerns as well. It would also be an issue for me if the challenges noted required a hardware change and I was unable to get my current NS3 upgraded.

Hoping that everyone's important issues get resolved and we can start sharing samples and patches soon!

Gambold wrote:Although I'm not surprised you don't hear anything - European companies in general, and Clavia in specific, are hardly renown for customer service. Here in the States, where capitalism is king, customer service is everything and makes or breaks a company.

Wow... I possibly sense a slight generalization here

It's interesting to note how different perspectives we all have. An equally broadly sweeping generalization around here would likely conclude the completely opposite view to yours, possibly adding that overseas companies are more likely to pay lip-service only. In addition, consumer protection laws are probably stronger here in practice.

Anyway, I've spent some 10 years in my previous jobs managing multinational supplier cooperation, contracts, legal, etc. There are enormous differences in company cultures, but this is not dictated by their nationality. And if anything, the companies that are based in smaller countries generally are more sensitive to the different markets, situations and their customers.

Gambold wrote: I will also say that all these problems with the Stage 3 are exactly why you DON'T order expensive keyboards from Europe if you live in the States,

Oh yeah, that is extremely dangerous... This goes for all the Japanese and Chinese suppliers as well, by the way And the other way round...

So that's why we supporting free trade and enabling a global market, I guess? Eh...

Gambold wrote: Does anyone really think that any company would pay anyone to go onto a forum of a boutique keyboard manufacturer, pretend they are an outraged customer, all with the dire hope of drumming up sales for their own brand?

I don't believe @jdahms is trolling. But observing biased or paid or trolling behavior is not new on the net. The anonymity is often used by people that want to purport a specific agenda. There are, as far as I know, even paid services, where you can have people give negative or positive ratings of something to boost or damage someones reputation. There are lots of twitter robots, etc. So pretending it would never happen means you may just be more susceptible to accept real #fakenews as real news.

Back to topic: I am also one of those that play my NS3 every day, and use it very frequently for gigs. It delivers just about all at I need (which may not be what everyone else needs). Could there be less bugs? Sure! But my view is that I think Nord will fix those. And in the meantime, I just keep playing it.

I'm sorry that @jdahms wasn't able to get the intended outcome from his NS3, and hope that he will fix his problems by using the NS2EX in the meantime, and possibly consider the NS3 again later (or some other keyboard that would support his needs). So all the best wishes to @jdahms from here; we tried to help but could not find working solutions for all of these scenarios.

>so that's why we supporting free trade and enabling a global market, I guess? Eh...<

You misunderstood this one.

I was referring to the high cost of returning an item purchased from a shop housed overseas. A few months ago, there was a thread about US customers buying a Stage 3 from a music store in Germany, since they had them in stock, ready to go. I counseled against this, because a close reading of that store's return policies revealed that a foreign buyer paid all shipping, regardless what the reason, for the return. Yes...regardless. All "free return shipping" was moot for overseas customers.

A subsequent check on the cheapest way possible to privately ship a 30-pound keyboard, in overseas freight-ready packaging, from the USA back to dear old Deutschland was coming in around $300. That's a lot of money to spend to return something that might be broken.

There is also the presumption that once the German store DOES receive it back, you will see your credit card speedily rebated - and when you don't, have fun making transatlantic calls to whomever is answering the phone at the counter of the store that day, and hope that their gymnasium-taught Englisch is up to snuff...

>The anonymity is often used by people that want to purport a specific agenda. There are, as far as I know, even paid services, where you can have people give negative or positive ratings of something to boost or damage someones reputation. <

Yeah, well, that's not what is going on here. Posting a complaint about bugs in Clavia's newest product on THIS forum seems a pretty weak way to boost sales for your own product - especially when you aren't mentioning it as an alternative in the post. I'm sorry to dissuade anyone of the grandeur of our little community, but we are just that...little.

When the satraps of Korg get together to decide upon whom next to rain their marketing fury, I can promise you that Clavia is far, far down on the list.

Gambold wrote:>so that's why we supporting free trade and enabling a global market, I guess? Eh...<

You misunderstood this one.

No, I didn't

Maybe buying overseas is new to some, but in this part of the world, we've been used to it for ages. There are even services that can help you bundle your shipment with others (to save freight), taking care of toll/taxation, etc.

In any case, wasn't it even so that the dare-devil buyer eventually got his device before everyone else in the US, and has been generally happy with it since?

Gambold wrote: Yeah, well, that's not what is going on here. Posting a complaint about bugs in Clavia's newest product on THIS forum seems a pretty weak way to boost sales for your product

Well, it's the best place to cause furor, as all the early (NS3) buyers appear to flock around here.

I completely agree that it's very unlikely to be the case wrt @jdahms case. But you argued that it would never happen, almost in a reductio ad absurdum way, which I objected to.

I trust you noticed the tongue-in-cheek tone in both my previous and in this reply.

EDIT: I'm not planning on any additional replies on these topics; so back on topic again on the Nord products