Piano sounds worse on my Electro 6 than my old Electro 4!

[cgrafx]

Before you do anything else, try plugging on a pair of headphones and see what that sounds like first.

I'm guessing the sound difference has way more to do with the mono setup than it does with an actual change in sound from the sample.

OP says the setup is the same as before, which was already in mono, so the audio chain has not changed, but your remark makes me think of another question to ask the OP: are you using the Mono mode on the NEs or just one of the OUT 1/2, but leaving the keyboard in stereo?

Yes, but the way each keyboard handles Mono/single-channel out is different. So if what they are hearing is just the stereo Right (upper side) of the sample its going to sound thin because it will be heavily upper register.

[manaje]

So I just did a complete AB test with dry versions of the Grand Upright Piano (XL):

Nord Grand Upright piano MONO (Electro 6)
Nord Grand Upright piano MONO MODE SWITCHED ON (Electro 6)
Nord Grand Upright piano STEREO (Electro 6)
Nord Grand Upright piano MONO (Electro 4)

All 4 pianos are dry (except for a touch of reverb on the three Electro 6 tracks via the onboard Electro 6 hall reverb) and are relatively volume-matched as well. The Electro 4 piano was recorded from an old song years ago, so it's a different piano part and it is completely dry and mono.

To my ears, the Electro 4 MONO upright sound is superior to all of the Electro 6 upright piano sounds... it sounds the most organic, most warm and full, most natural with the most dynamics, and the least artifical-sounding (especially when properly mixed with reverb and all types of EQ/Compression/Saturation... the current Electro 4 sound you're hearing is completely dry)... but I will admit the Electro 6 STEREO upright sound is not entirely bad. The Mono Electro 6 vs the Mono Mode switched on Electro 6 was a very minimal difference, it was not game-changing difference in tonality to my ears, very similar artificial-sounding piano.

So this is still a huge problem for me, because I spent a fair amount of money upgrading to the Electro 6 but the Grand Upright Piano sound is what I use live 75% of the time when I'm playing, and since I rely on it's MONO sound heavily within my live and recording setup (I like to run my Electro through a myriad of guitar pedals for various effects and moments within a live set), this new Electro 6 version of the MONO grand upright piano sound is not usable at all for me, it truly is THAT much of a downgrade to me sonically in all ways. But perhaps my ears are so biased towards that older Electro 4 Grand Upright Piano sound after all those years of using it in so many tracks and when performing live. It just felt immediately inspirational to me, and that inspiration is now gone (sorry to be dramatic!).

I'm at a loss! I may just have to sell my Electro 6HP and re-purchase a used Electro 4HP again. Yikes.

[maxpiano]

So I just did a complete AB test with dry versions of the Grand Upright Piano (XL):

Nord Grand Upright piano MONO (Electro 6)
Nord Grand Upright piano MONO MODE SWITCHED ON (Electro 6)
Nord Grand Upright piano STEREO (Electro 6)
Nord Grand Upright piano MONO (Electro 4)

What's the difference between the first two? When you write just "MONO" where do you take the output signal from (which output)?

PS: have you also tried the EQ and/or Kbd Touch I suggested on NE6 or if not what are your settings?

[cgrafx]

To my ears, the Right Channel of the electro 6 in the stereo recording is almost identical to your Electro 4 recording.

The right channel would correspond with the brighter upper side of the stereo recording/sample.

[cphollis]

For readers new to the Nord world, the Electro 6 was released in 2018, so about 5 years ago. The Electro 4 was released in 2014, so close to a decade ago. There are likely many thousands of each in the wild, as these are popular keyboards. This is the first instance that I have seen here where someone noticed a meaningful difference between the same sample being played on one vs. the other.

[manaje]

So I just did a complete AB test with dry versions of the Grand Upright Piano (XL):

Nord Grand Upright piano MONO (Electro 6)
Nord Grand Upright piano MONO MODE SWITCHED ON (Electro 6)
Nord Grand Upright piano STEREO (Electro 6)
Nord Grand Upright piano MONO (Electro 4)

What's the difference between the first two? When you write just "MONO" where do you take the output signal from (which output)?

PS: have you also tried the EQ and/or Kbd Touch I suggested on NE6 or if not what are your settings?

The difference is whether or not the MONO switch was turned on or off on the Electro 6 (Shift + KBD Touch). Both the "MONO" and the "MONO MODE SWITCHED ON" were taken from the Left output of the Electro 6.

I have tried playing with the EQ and Kbd Touch, still isn't making much of a difference to me. On all 4 of the sound clips above, there was no EQ or efx at all, and it was set to Kbd touch 1. At this point of doing a detailed AB analysis, I'm pretty sure it's one of two things: Nord has tinkered with the sound of the Grand Upright Piano sample for the newer models of their keyboards, or the newer DAC's are responsible for the change in tonality. My guess is that the actual sample itself has been tinkered with (which I obviously think is now significantly worse).

[manaje]

To my ears, the Right Channel of the electro 6 in the stereo recording is almost identical to your Electro 4 recording.

The right channel would correspond with the brighter upper side of the stereo recording/sample.

Interesting... both of the MONO sound clips were from the left output specifically, so I just tried the same piano part with same settings using the right output for mono, and it does sound brighter and less muddy. Even still, the sound of the piano is definitely very different than before, in a less flattering way altogether.

[manaje]

For readers new to the Nord world, the Electro 6 was released in 2018, so about 5 years ago. The Electro 4 was released in 2014, so close to a decade ago. There are likely many thousands of each in the wild, as these are popular keyboards. This is the first instance that I have seen here where someone noticed a meaningful difference between the same sample being played on one vs. the other.

Yes but I've done my best to provide actual audio evidence for the difference in the sound. Don't you hear a significant difference between the Mono Electro 4 sound clip and the Mono Electro 6 sound clip? Both are relatively level-matched and are dry other than a touch of Nord Hall reverb. To me it's a night and day difference.

[harmonizer]

I only listened on headphones (Grado SR80e - I think they cost about $100?).
I only listened to the three mono recordings (1 from the E4 and the 2 from E6). On my headphones, I could not really notice a difference between these 3, but I realize that a decent pair of headphones makes things sound better than almost any real speaker-based system, so my headphone test might not prove anything.

[maurus]

Manaje,

here is a question for you: How are you actually *listening* to your Electros? Are we speaking of amplified sound through speakers, or are we speaking of listening with headphones?

Maybe I missed this in the thread above. But: When I changed from an Electro 5 to an Electro 6 for a while I found something very similar to your description *when listening with my phones*. All piano sounds on the E5 sounded much more substantial than on the E6, and no amount of EQ would cure it. Well, I think what was changed was the headphone output, and as we all (should) know there may be a problem of impedance matching at this point which can dramatically alter sound. I did NOT have the same problem when amplifying the Electro, and so getting a new set of phones or a headphone amplifier was the solution. (In the end I kept my E5 73 and sold the E6 61 again, but for different reasons - it had more keys .)