B3/leslie types - Can you hear the difference

[Gambold]

>At this point my first Nord is my last. I'd love to have my mind changed on that.<

And what would do that, I hear you ask? Pricing is not an issue if the feature set moves along with the times. So with that said, here's what's new on my Electro 6:

1) Bluetooth capability. At least offer it as an option for a reasonable (that's REASONABLE) additional cost. Nah, forget that - make it standard.
2) Balanced (XLR) outs. Earth to Clavia - it's pro gear. A stage keyboard. It is not a Telecaster.
3) A redesigned preset system with lights in the knobs that is easy and obvious - not an intelligence test.
4) A freaking music stand and built-in brackets to attach it. DUH. At least put the brackets on and you can ream us for the stand as an accessory.
5) Enough memory so the file size creep is no longer a talking point - we can load everything in the piano libraries, all at XL.
6) An XL version of the Grand Lady D. Ok, that's not essential, but it's a great sample, how about an update?
7) A Rhodes sample that no-one, or almost no-one, can complain about, that doesn't need EQ or tweaking or forum posters pretending it's great.
8) A 1/8 headphone jack. No-one makes 1/4 jack headphones anymore so you have to use adapters and they always end up not working.
9) An IDevice version of Sound Manager. If this doesn't come out soon, you will start losing customers. Trust me on this.
10) An online shop for Nord-branded accessories and apparel. Caps, shirts, coffee cups, carry bags! Not to mention soft and hard carrying cases, pedals, and parts.

[cgrafx]

Curios about what do you want to do with bluetooth?

[analogika]

We'll see how well the Stage 3 does in the market - I'll make book that it's not going to be a barn burner. It's too expensive and didn't make enough changes to the previous model.

I'll give you the price argument (it seems to be considerably more expensive on your side of the pond), but "not enough changes"? The new synth alone is worth the price of having sold my Stage 2 and bought the new one! (IMO, of course)

So, let's take a look at your list.

1) Bluetooth capability. At least offer it as an option for a reasonable (that's REASONABLE) additional cost. Nah, forget that - make it standard.
2) Balanced (XLR) outs. Earth to Clavia - it's pro gear. A stage keyboard. It is not a Telecaster.
3) A redesigned preset system with lights in the knobs that is easy and obvious - not an intelligence test.
4) A freaking music stand and built-in brackets to attach it. DUH. At least put the brackets on and you can ream us for the stand as an accessory.
5) Enough memory so the file size creep is no longer a talking point - we can load everything in the piano libraries, all at XL.
6) An XL version of the Grand Lady D. Ok, that's not essential, but it's a great sample, how about an update?
7) A Rhodes sample that no-one, or almost no-one, can complain about, that doesn't need EQ or tweaking or forum posters pretending it's great.
8) A 1/8 headphone jack. No-one makes 1/4 jack headphones anymore so you have to use adapters and they always end up not working.
9) An IDevice version of Sound Manager. If this doesn't come out soon, you will start losing customers. Trust me on this.
10) An online shop for Nord-branded accessories and apparel. Caps, shirts, coffee cups, carry bags! Not to mention soft and hard carrying cases, pedals, and parts.

1) Eh. I get wireless MIDI, flaky though it can still be on occasion. Having the iPad wirelessly transmit to the Macbook is nice. However, we're talking about a stage instrument. I replace my work computers every five or so years (the iPad a little sooner). But my Electro is now ten years old, and I'm pretty sure it'll be in use ten years from now. Which version of Bluetooth do you think they should include that isn't absolutely ludicrously useless fifteen years from now? A Bluetooth MIDI adapter is $50, and the next four generations of wireless MIDI adapter will work seamlessly with whatever protocol is en vogue then, and cost around that.

2) XLR - I'm with you. Hardly a deal-breaker, though. The only keyboards I own that have XLR outs (see signature) are the Wurli 200A (non-stock Palmer transformer added at my behest) and the Memorymoog (XLR mono output disconnected when the Lintronics upgrade was installed — replaced by stereo 1/4" jacks). So, er, I disagree that a keyboard isn't "professional" if it doesn't have XLRs. Nice to have, though.

3) "redesigned preset system" - please explain. "Lights in the knobs" makes no sense to me; lights under the buttons and a big honking display seem equally if not considerably more useful. I'd like a faster way to navigate banks, if that's what you mean. I'd also love for all morphable parameters to have LED rings around the encoders, but I understand that is unrealistic.

4) Music stand. Hm. I have no use for this. On a Piano, it makes sense — pianists usually only have a single 'board, and they tend to work from notation. Those are criteria that hardly apply to the target market for the Nord Stage. I have a Hercules clamp for the iPad, and I need to flexibly position it wherever it makes sense in a given rehearsal or live setup. I would in no way expect Clavia to cater to this.

5) Piano storage - I hear you.

7)
You honestly believe that anybody can put anything on the internet, and nobody will complain about it?
I love the Nefertiti 5.3 with the detuned C#, and I'm keeping it. There's quirks all over it, with chipped hammers and slightly misaligned pickups. The day the people complaining about it will stop complaining is the day they stop sampling actual instruments and go full Yamaha, with idealised clichés of what the instruments should sound like in a pop context. That's not what they do.

8) I realise that 1/8" jacks are now considered "professional" standard, but as far as I'm concerned, the damn things can go effing DIAF. Any 1/8" headphone will work with a readily availalbe adapter (that isn't crap), but any older professional headphones with 1/4" jacks will need one that certainly isn't common.

9) iPad Sound Manager!!! YES!!! I very, very much doubt that not having one will cause them to lose many customers, but I'd love to have one, indeed.

10) Official merchandise has been available for years: https://shop.spreadshirt.net/nordkeyboards/

[anotherscott]

Yeah, I have a problem when a company charges top $$$ for their keyboards and you still have to lug computers on stage just to access their features in a sane and efficient manner.

I think it's safe to say that most people who use a Nord Stage don't also bring a computer. That said, even just an iPhone or iPad makes a nice adjunct, and so many of us bring one of those everywhere anyway.

You can only sail along on the sample library for so long.

Who says? Of course, they have a lot more than that... sound quality, general feature set, the real-time knobby orientation...

here's what's new on my Electro 6:

We all have our own wish lists, though certain things seem to crop up more often than others. As for your list... I don't care about bluetooth. For what? (There are already adapters you can plug into the MIDI port if you want to convert them to bluetooth.) XLR? It would be nice, but not essential. Almost no boards have them. Especially in the NE5D-and-down price range. (The only one I can think of offhand = is the Korg SV1.) I'd see that coming to a Stage before an Electro, if anything. Almost no one has music stand support either, except boards largely designed for home use, though I agree, they would be nice to see, if only as a place to put our ipads. More memory is always nice, but is somewhat pricey, for the kind Nord needs. Again, the Stage has more, and I'd expect that to continue to be the case. Sample requests are always subjective. 1/8" headphone, really? From the person who wants XLRs? iDevice Sound Manager would be cool, not sure its viable, as Apple imposes numerous restrictions as to what can be done over USB.

[Quai34]

"Same here. My job is in playing and sound technology. "
oK, it's just that it had started to be a one to one or a one to two conversation with a lot of technical stuffs that only very few of us understand....As Baggart said, sorry, yes, you're right , back to the topic...Ok, I could have been "nicer" in the way I asked that but that was my point...I will always love your opinion about "If this or that sounds good or not" but the DSP versus ??? I don't even remember already what it was, might have been at a better place than in this thread...It was looking like two Engineers discussing about the last technology...Well, it was in fact, but we are not all engineers...
That's it, no offense guys, I didn't want to hurt anyone...

[Quai34]

"and play some Mozart using the vintage 2 settings on the B3":
Well, I never tried any Mozart on a B3, could be funny though, yes, I will try, good idea...

[PScooter63]

Gambold, about your E6 laundry list... an entertaining read, surely. But:

1. Bluetooth: those who know what it is and need it, also know how to get it. Non-issue, unless perhaps you're trying to run both wired AND Bluetooth MIDI. Sounds edge-casey for now. (Surely you're not suggesting Bluetooth AUDIO support, are you? Universally meh, aside from Apple's proprietary W1-chip implementation.)
2. Instead of XLR, how about balanced TRS 1/4"? I'd be all over that.
3. Redesigned preset system, befitting your level of intelligence? (Sorry, you left the door wide open for that.) I have to believe they are already working on something, but it can't be too jarring of a change or the client base might reject it... unless of course it is a why-didn't-anyone-think-of-that-before sea change, which generally happens only once in a few decades.
4. Stand support - not sure if you're talking about legs or the music desk, but Nord already offers both. Maybe you're talking specifically about the Compact, in which case I'd agree, a real head-scratcher. I mean, my E4HP is a 73-noter that accepts both.
5. Memory - news flash, G, this will ALWAYS be a talking point. Even if Nord doubled their current capacities, factions would still whine. Heck, look at smartphone capacities for a parallel. It's a safe bet that Nord is splitting the difference between expense and usability, as any sane manufacturer would. Now, if they offered a memory expansion kit or something, a la Kurzweil back in the day... yeah, that would be nice, but it would still be expensive to design, and the concept seems to have fallen out of vogue generally.
6. Great sample... for you. It left my E4 in the first week I owned it, and has never returned. Just sayin'.
9. iOS support *would* be outstanding, especially with the new file management infrastructure that debuted in iOS 11. I'd even pay for the apps. But losing customers over this? To whom?

[analogika]

"Same here. My job is in playing and sound technology. "
oK, it's just that it had started to be a one to one or a one to two conversation with a lot of technical stuffs that only very few of us understand....As Baggart said, sorry, yes, you're right , back to the topic...Ok, I could have been "nicer" in the way I asked that but that was my point...I will always love your opinion about "If this or that sounds good or not" but the DSP versus ??? I don't even remember already what it was, might have been at a better place than in this thread...It was looking like two Engineers discussing about the last technology...Well, it was in fact, but we are not all engineers...
That's it, no offense guys, I didn't want to hurt anyone...

The point is that some people aren’t happy with the sound and the options of the B-3 engine on the Nord Stage 3. The discussion moved to what we might reasonably expect from a technical standpoint.

That was a lot more relevant to the topic (and more interesting, IMO) than talking about whether transitive technology like Bluetooth, or dinky 1/8“ jacks, should be added to professional keyboards.

[analogika]

iDevice Sound Manager would be cool, not sure its viable, as Apple imposes numerous restrictions as to what can be done over USB.

AFAIK, Lightning is pretty much wide-open. The point of the protocol was that it can be literally anything and connect to any hardware, with the possibility of driver support built into the corresponding app.

Seeing as the Nord Stage requires no drivers on the Mac, it seems extremely unlikely that technical limitations are holding back Clavia from writing an iOS version.

I’m betting that it’s tight personnel and questionable return on investment that keeps them from supporting a third platform.

[PScooter63]

That was a lot more relevant to the topic (and more interesting, IMO) than talking about whether transitive technology like Bluetooth, or dinky 1/8“ jacks, should be added to professional keyboards.

Guilty as charged, I fell for the bait. Sorry about sending the thread further off topic.