Nord Electro 5 organ sim vs. earlier models

[michael_C1]

spectrum e5 low c 808.txt

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spectrum e3 low c 808.txt

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There are a lot of good things about the Electro 5 but I find the organ disappointing. Unlike the Hammond sim in other Nord models, there is always distortion present, you can’t get rid of it, and there’s not nearly enough bass and fullness in the bottom end for my liking.

Those who like a screaming upper register, or play in a loud rock group, or like an overdriven sound, as well as those who don’t play a lot of organ will likely be very happy with the Electro 5 organ. But personally, I like the option of having a sweet, clean, and full bodied organ sound sometimes, and the ability to run left hand bass with authority when needed. For those types of sounds, the Electro 5 doesn’t cut it, IMO.

The 145 rotary is a contributing factor, but the sound starts with the organ model itself. For whatever reason, Clavia opted for a different sound this time around.

***To demonstrate some of the tonal differences, I’ve attached two text files of spectrum analyses done while playing low C (bottom organ note) on my Nord Electro 3 and my new Electro 5. I balanced the middle octave volumes of both keyboards before testing. Software used was Audacity. A difference of +6dB effectively doubles the volume, whereas -6dB halves the volume, if I understand correctly. For the test, I used a drawbar setting of 808000000 which is a standard bass setting. Audacity only registers frequencies down to 172Hz, but that’s still useful in this case.

You’ll notice that for the very lowest frequency (172 Hz) the Electro 5 is less than half the volume of the Electro 3, and that for other low frequencies the difference is even greater. A difference of -10dB is somewhere between 3-4 times less volume.

[RedLeo]

Did you not think to check the sound out before you bought it? It's not as if there aren't a ton of alternative Hammond clones to choose from. Nord organs are well-known for having a cutting sound rather than a mellow sound, it's no great secret.

[michael_C1]

I plotted your data to see what it is you want to illustrate:


I'm certain Audacity produces audio spectra below 172Hz. Since you played a note (probably C0 or C1 at 16Hz or 32Hz) the differences over 5 octaves away (at 172 Hz) don't matter as much as whats going on at or near the fundamental frequency of the note.

The data you present shows that the E3 has higher energy at frequencies away from the fundamental, but without the relative amplitudes at the fundamental, comparison is nearly meaningless.

You may be right about the differences you hear, but your data doesn't support your case yet.

I tried my E3 at the settings you mention. With a quick setup (I converted the first organ program I found to B3, and cleared all effects), I got a sudden drop off in volume in the lower split in the lowest octave compared to the next highest (and I checked, this was all below the split point). This something like what you describe, but on the E3.

I'm guessing there's something in the setups that causes the differences you hear.

[michael_C1]

Hi, michael_C1, that spectrogram looks a bit strange. You should see at least two peaks if you are using 808000000 (one at ~65 and the other at ~130Hz, if that is the same range as in the NS2)
BTW the bounds for the spectrum of Audacity can be set in the preferences (CTRL+P) as well as the length of the FFT (which should be way-way larger than 128 sample (which is the setting you have at the moment).

[michael_C1]

Did you not think to check the sound out before you bought it? It's not as if there aren't a ton of alternative Hammond clones to choose from. Nord organs are well-known for having a cutting sound rather than a mellow sound, it's no great secret.

First of all, I think it's great when members here question each other, support each other, teach each other, and punch holes in each other's theories, or else why are we here? But I don't appreciate it when someone gets on my case for expressing an opinion.

If the Electro 5 organ sound had been a deal breaker I could have returned the instrument after I purchased it, and I didn’t. That should tell you something. But in my opinion the organ sim isn’t as good as in previous implementations.

Nord organs are well-known for having a cutting sound rather than a mellow sound, it's no great secret.

I have no problem getting a mellow sound out of my Electro 3.

[michael_C1]

I'm certain Audacity produces audio spectra below 172Hz. Since you played a note (probably C0 or C1 at 16Hz or 32Hz) the differences over 5 octaves away (at 172 Hz) don't matter as much as whats going on at or near the fundamental frequency of the note.

The data you present shows that the E3 has higher energy at frequencies away from the fundamental, but without the relative amplitudes at the fundamental, comparison is nearly meaningless.

You may be right about the differences you hear, but your data doesn't support your case yet.

Hi, michael_C1, that spectrogram looks a bit strange. You should see at least two peaks if you are using 808000000 (one at ~65 and the other at ~130Hz, if that is the same range as in the NS2)
BTW the bounds for the spectrum of Audacity can be set in the preferences (CTRL+P) as well as the length of the FFT (which should be way-way larger than 128 sample (which is the setting you have at the moment).

Thank you both for taking the time to teach me something. I was winging it with Audacity obviously I stand by what I'm hearing, but I certainly didn't illustrate it well.
It's more my speed to put up audio files, and I'll try to do that when I have a chance.

[pterm]

Thank you both for taking the time to teach me something. I was winging it with Audacity obviously I stand by what I'm hearing, but I certainly didn't illustrate it well.
It's more my speed to put up audio files, and I'll try to do that when I have a chance.

I like that you tried to use Audacity to objectively quantify the differences.
If you decide to post audio samples, it'd be handy if include the middle note (where you level balance the two E5 and E3), then walk down through the same note pattern on each keyboard. This way we should be able to see the way the level (allegedly ) decreases with decreasing frequency for each board.

My copy of Audacity stopped running on my Linux PC since the last time I used it. If you post these audio samples, it will give me an excuse to revive it and re-familiarize myself with Audacity.


I also liked that you put RedLeo in his place: He's a bad man who wants to throw magnets at my head. nord-electro-forum-f9/don-t-set-a-magne ... 10206.html

[michael_C1]

Thanks pterm, sounds like a plan!

As for magnets, I'll watch my back.. or my head

[RedLeo]

But I don't appreciate it when someone gets on my case for expressing an opinion.

To what purpose? You've got plenty of choices to do something about it, but instead you've decided to do nothing and whinge about it on the internet. You chose it, you decided to keep it. It's not as if anybody here can actually do anything about it, and I think the forum is better served by not being turned into a pointless moan-zone.

Nord organs are well-known for having a cutting sound rather than a mellow sound, it's no great secret.

I have no problem getting a mellow sound out of my Electro 3.

You should have checked. Your keyboard, your responsibility.

[michael_C1]

Red Leo,

You're out of line. But I have no intention of descending to the personal level as you have done, although I'm sorely tempted. And I have no intention of responding to anything more you have to say.