Got my Nord Stage B-Stock but the wheel is dead

[anotherscott]

But my point is why can't this arranger be used on a stage in a band

This is a lot of thread drift, but sure, of course an arranger can be used that way.

In fact, one of my favorite combinations I've been playing with this year is a Nord Stage 4 with a Korg PA1000. Nord wins on piano, organ, VA synth, easy incorporation of custom samples, speed of assembling patches, MIDI functionality (controlling or being partially controlled by other boards), and real-time interactivity (i.e. the morphs and all the real-time front panel control). Korg wins on the non-piano/organ/synth sounds (i.e. emulations of other acoustic instruments), including having the kinds of articulations you're talking about, and it has touchscreen patch navigation (including search and set list functions), and good rhythm programs, which I use on my duo/trio gigs that don't include a live drummer. It does have a drawback in that its workflow, front panel layout, and manual are all centered on an arranger orientation I don't really use, so it can take some extra effort and "re-thinking" to use it the way I need. (Also, I would have preferred the PA4X with its better action, full set of sliders, assignable outs, better screen... but it crossed my "too heavy" threshold.)

When I don't need the drum accompaniment, I'm more likely to take my MODX7. It's lighter weight, 76 keys, with a better workflow/interface (for my purposes), and is more versatile in other ways... but I do miss the aftertouch and some of the sounds of the Korg. The new MODX M looks even nicer, with a lot of additional front panel control, better seamless sound switching (up to 6 parts instead of 4), improved split management, and (coming in January) improved scene functionality and a full VST implementation as well. All that even before you get to any of the sonic enhancements. (Some of which actually make it more Nord-competitive... VA synth engine, updated pianos/EPs, better rotary effect.) Though you're presumably already familiar with all of this from your Montage M experience.

Bottom line: There are multiple ways to accomplish one's goals, with different trade-offs. Use whatever works for you.

[Gambold]

Also, it has to be said...if you are in the market for a keyboard and want to buy a Nord, you don't buy a "B-stock" model. You pony up for the full boat price, or get a used instrument from a reputable seller, one that you've had a chance to run through its paces.

Buying B-stock, demos, refurbished or some such equipment is always a crapshoot. You get what you pay for. Nords are high-end keyboards marketed to customers with fat wallets. If your wallet isn't fat enough, then wait until it is or look at other brands.

I'm not a snob - I can't afford the new Stage and I'm not ashamed to say it. And the Piano is pretty damn pricey for what you get too. So I'm waiting for the fabled (and probably never appearing) Electro 7 to see if I can come back to Nord. I hope I can. But if they don't make significant upgrades and then still price it to the moon, I will continue to be an ex-Nordie.

Meanwhile, Yamaha just released an upgrade with a new acoustic grand piano sample for the YC88. When was the last time Nord released a non-specific (i.e. Soft, Felt, web blanket) grand piano sample? The White Grand, back in June of 2019. Over six years ago. And counting.

[Schorsch]

You obviously haven't heard the sounds inside the Event in comparison to the Nord.
.
.
.
But my point is why can't this arranger be used on a stage in a band and make that band sound better?

I still believe that you have obviously not informed yourself sufficiently about the capabilities and possible applications of Nord instruments.

Their concept is tailored to live musicians, with a focus on specific high-quality sound ranges, which for the Stage series primarily comprise three sound engines: organ, piano and synthesis. The sample synth section is just a relatively simple addition to the synthesis engine for cases where a specific sound is needed that cannot be produced with the three sound engines. However, this section is relatively limited, as the samples are only single-layered, but can be modified using the synth engine's filters.

The Nords are not designed to compete with workstations such as Kronos, Montage, Fantom or (arranger) keyboards, and any comparison with these instruments only proves that the person making the comparison has no idea about Nord instruments; it is, as Max says, like comparing apples with peaches.

The advantages of the Nords, apart from the quality of the three sound engines mentioned, are that you have all the controls at your fingertips without (or very rarely) having to use the menus, and that they have a very fast start-up time (a few seconds compared to several minutes for some of the instruments mentioned), which requires special hardware components such as quite expensive memory technology. All of this is extremely important for live musicians on stage, and those who understand and need this are (of course) willing to pay the price for it.

If you dislike the Nord so much and prefer these other instruments, why do you spend so much time repeating the same thing over and over again and criticising it, instead of simply returning the Nord (you have a reason to do so) and being satisfied with one of the other instruments?

[davlippo7]

I did return it or in the process but it's nice but it is an extremely niche item because so many other options at that price and even less.

I have had everything and the YC61 and YC73 and SKpro for many years. But those prices made a lot more sense at the time. I probably didn't pay over $2,500 for either of those. I do understand what they are used for I just don't use them in that way I'm always in the home studio playing for a total of 20 minutes on 13 different keyboards. But I'm typically selling them along the way in order to try something else.

I've just always heard how good Nord was so thought why not get one. And then the crazy stuff happened with my unit but It won't be the last time. I actually repaired it for them but no good deed goes unpunished.

[davlippo7]

I understand people want a single board that does everything.

We forget MIDI was implemented in the 80s I think.

A Yamaha SeqTrak is about $350. Get a piece of plywood and a nice controller say a YC61 for $1,500 used it can control 4 channels simultaneously and mount (4) SeqTraks all MIDI-up and you will destroy a Nord or anything else. 16 layers, (4) FM synths, all with effects x4, (8) AWM channels, (4) drum machines and sequencers, (4) channels with custom samples, plus all the YC61 can do and effects on top of all of that for 1/2 the price.

We're so silly forgetting about the power of MIDI and affordable gear no reason ever to pay $6,000 for a single board, ever! We don't want to be inconvenienced pushing a few extra buttons but then you're paying $3,000 more for that convenience. I think we think someone will get our job If I don't buy a Nord or whatever is popular at the time. Some of the greatest stuff was written and played on simplistic units like the Casio CZ-100.

It's a fad not a necessity. BTW the SeqTrak has 2 thousand voices (not including the FM engine) not just a few hundred then x4 or however many you chain together. I might assemble this for a YT video one day and blow everyone's mind. Mix up the ST colors too. I can't believe the sounds that come out of that Lego block Kind of embarrasses everyone else and nobody knows about it because it looks like a toy.

I'd argue one YC61 with one SeqTrak beats the NS4 for under $2,000. Try it if you dare or are you scared?

[davlippo7]

This setup was all of $1,000 with thousands of voices and millions of combinations and only (2) devices but I understand the differences.

Here's the YC73 with SeqTrak and Moog Muse oh and the Behringer Strings Machine hidden from view. With the AnalogRytm MKII.

[anotherscott]

I understand people want a single board that does everything.

The NS4 does not do everything, by a long shot. But it does some things particularly well. (And many--perhaps most?--NS4 owners don't have it as their only board.)

A Yamaha SeqTrak is about $350. Get a piece of plywood and a nice controller say a YC61 for $1,500 used it can control 4 channels simultaneously and mount (4) SeqTraks all MIDI-up and you will destroy a Nord or anything else. 16 layers, (4) FM synths, all with effects x4, (8) AWM channels, (4) drum machines and sequencers, (4) channels with custom samples, plus all the YC61 can do

The YC61 by itself has some amount of Nord Stage functionality, and adding even a single Seqtrak will get around some of its relative limitations compared to the Nord (e.g. having only a single split point, and only being able to split/layer 2 sounds that aren't an organ). Other things Seqtrak adds to the YC are things the Nord doesn't have either (i.e. full FM synth, drums, sequencer), but of course, if you want those things, you can add the Seqtrak to the Nord as well.

But as for one "destroying" the other... Compared to the Nord, a YC61+ Seqtrak(s) still doesn't give you any VA synthesis, the same kind of custom sample functionality, or the performance benefits of things like morphs, aftertouch, various dedicated pedals, and immediate access to such a wide range of parameters, in a unified interface. If you just want a ton of quality sounds but don't care so much about things like a fast, consistent, ergonomic tactile environment for them, why even choose the YC61 and Seqtraks? If what really matters is "how much of this" and "how many of that," you can do better with a laptop and a bunch of VSTs. And indeed, this is a viable route for many people. If you like the YC61 as a base, for $1400 of add-on, I think a laptop and software will go farther than 4 Seqtraks. That more than covers the cost of a Macbook Air and Mainstage, for example.

We don't want to be inconvenienced pushing a few extra buttons

As I talked about above (e.g. "performance benefits"), it's more than just pushing a few extra buttons. Plus in live performance, seconds matter. It's really a matter of what your goal is. If you need a car for local errands, you don't buy a corvette, and then complain that it's a lot of money for something you can't even fit your groceries into.