Nord Stage 3 switches to the Live mode constantly

[daemmerung]

HI,

I'm experiencing a very weird issue (presumably a bug) with Nord Stage 3. To give a bit of context: my Nord Stage 3 is connected to the Macbook and I'm using Logic Pro X as a DAW. I also have another MIDI keyboard as my primary controller (Roland A-88 MKII if that matters). Normally I create an external software instrument in Logic, redirecting the message from my primary MIDI keyboard to the Nord Stage 3 and "catching" the sound from the corresponding line inputs (from the audio interface). That has all worked well until I once pressed (by accident) "Live Mode" button on Nord Stage 3 while being connected to the DAW. After that something seem to have went wrong with the Nord Stage 3: now whenever I switch between tracks in Logic Pro X or changing instruments or something like this, Nord constantly switches to the Live Mode.

I've tried rebooting the Macbook, rebooting Nord, reconnecting cables and checking all Nord settings, it all looks good, but I could not find what causes this weird behavior. I used MIDI Monitor trying to intercept the messages send from/to MIDI controllers and noticed that whenever I change tracks in DAW or do any other related operations (that previously did not have any effect on Nord's state), the MIDI led blinks once on the Nord and the MIDI Monitor shows a "Control Breath (Coarse)" message sent to the "MIDI Input" with a value of 90.

Have you guys ever experienced this weird issue? I actually created a similar question on the Logic forum (just in case it's something wrong went with Logic), but I suspect that something is off with the Nord Stage 3 as I was not able to reproduce this issue with other MIDI controllers. The "Control Breath" CC message is only sent to Nord Stage 3 for some reason, I'm also not sure why Nord reacts to it by switching to the Live mode.

Regards,
Daniel

[FZiegler]

Simple solution to your question:

"Control Breath (coarse)" is - according to the MIDI specification usually CC02. But as your Stage doesn't have a breath control, CC02 is used in a different way. What your Stage understands when it's got sent a CC02, is "Live mode" (according to the NS3 CC list in the manual).

So, obviously, you were not only switching to Live Mode once you were working in Logic, but you were sending a CC02 at the same time. It was registered by Logic and this is faithfully reproduced every time. Get this command erased!

That's it.

[DougB217]

I think you need to go into Logic and check for control surface data, you might find the CC02 data saved there. Another thing I’ve heard of is deleting your preferences.plist file.

[daemmerung]

"Control Breath (coarse)" is - according to the MIDI specification usually CC02. But as your Stage doesn't have a breath control, CC02 is used in a different way. What your Stage understands when it's got sent a CC02, is "Live mode" (according to the NS3 CC list in the manual).

Oh, now I got it, it explains why breath control is interpreted as live mode, i.e. it's part of a specification / documented way how the Nord Stage 3 is supposed to work. Thanks for pointing this out.

So, obviously, you were not only switching to Live Mode once you were working in Logic, but you were sending a CC02 at the same time. It was registered by Logic and this is faithfully reproduced every time.

Did I get it right: the first time I used the Live mode while being connected to logic sent the CC02 from Nord to the Logic and Logis somehow registered / saved it somewhere and now tries to send it for no reason or something like this?

Get this command erased!

Erased from what? I may assume (based on your answer) that Logic saved the information about CC02 somewhere and sends it sporadically (well, when I switch tracks etc), but how do I erase it? I checked the Control Surfaces preferences, assignments and setup, but could not find anything that would look suspicious.

[FZiegler]

We only know what you were reporting. So we don't know if Logic sends this message only to the Nord, or if it always send it and only the Nord interprets it as "Live Mode". Try the options DougB217 mentions. That would be the part the pals from the Logic forum would have to help with.

[baekgaard]

Yes, the problem is that Logic has recorded the "switch to live mode" command and stores that somewhere in or with the track. I don't use Logic, so I'm not really able to help here either, otherwise

[daemmerung]

Yes, the problem is that Logic has recorded the "switch to live mode" command and stores that somewhere in or with the track. I don't use Logic, so I'm not really able to help here either, otherwise

Oh no-no, it's not recorded The recording is something I checked immediately (automation data) to see if there is something recorded, but the problem is that I'v having this issue even in the new empty project. It also happens when I just change the Software Instrument / VST plugin. Pretty much almost any action in DAW. I of course asked the question on the Logic forum and in case it's the Logic which is buggy, I would post a solution here for the ones who are experiencing the same obscure problem.

Nevertheless, thanks guys for the suggestions.

[FZiegler]

I'd first of all try to understand where this comes from. Considering the Stage or Logic as buggy wouldn't be my first approach to a "solution" to the problem. It's only the question where that CC02 command comes from. It is there. It will be recognised as "breath control/coarse" by any MIDI monitor. And it will be interpreted as "Live Mode" by any Stage in any OS version. So far no bugs. Just the question why it is sent - and what to do to stop that. But from the Logic side.

[daemmerung]

I'd first of all try to understand where this comes from. Considering the Stage or Logic as buggy wouldn't be my first approach to a "solution" to the problem. It's only the question where that CC02 command comes from. It is there. It will be recognised as "breath control/coarse" by any MIDI monitor. And it will be interpreted as "Live Mode" by any Stage in any OS version. So far no bugs. Just the question why it is sent - and what to do to stop that. But from the Logic side.

Absolutely! My goal is not just to fix bug or report it somewhere, I know what happens (I mean, I knew what happened before writing the post, i.e. I aware that the Nord receives Breath Control message, it was just not clear why it switches to Live Mode [now it's clear why] and why it is sent after all). I still can't quite understand why Nord receives this command and why no other MIDI controllers don't receive it. I'm very curious what makes Logic send this command and why it never happened before. Still waiting for a response from the Logic Pro guys in a separate topic, hopefully someone would be able to shed some light.

[baekgaard]

Yes, the problem is that Logic has recorded the "switch to live mode" command and stores that somewhere in or with the track. I don't use Logic, so I'm not really able to help here either, otherwise

Oh no-no, it's not recorded The recording is something I checked immediately (automation data) to see if there is something recorded, but the problem is that I'v having this issue even in the new empty project. It also happens when I just change the Software Instrument / VST plugin. Pretty much almost any action in DAW. I of course asked the question on the Logic forum and in case it's the Logic which is buggy, I would post a solution here for the ones who are experiencing the same obscure problem.

Nevertheless, thanks guys for the suggestions.

If it's not "recorded" somehow (either in the track or in the "instrument setup" if Logic has such a concept like Cubase has), then you could try to create a new empty project (without switching to live mode) and see if the same thing happens with that

But it's probably stored somewhere in Logic as a state; if not in the track itself, then likely in some track settings; as said, I dont' use Logic, but Cubase at least can be set up to send some initial values and program changes that I think is stored in the track settings and not the recording itself, IIRC.