Nord User Forum

So I have tried setting the velocity dynamics on the piano panel to the lowest setting (no LEDs lit) and the MIDI Keyb in "EXTERN" to "Hard" on both panels, or even "soft" and it doesn't seem to make much of a difference. I was trying to use my Kawai MP11 to control the piano sounds in my NS3 but no matter what, the velocity curve is just too sensitive and it's very hard to play softly with the weighted controller. I get better control just playing the SW waterfall keys straight. I was really hoping I could have the option of using an external keyboard for my NS3C, especially if I want to play a show where there's a lot of piano-heavy stuff, but not have to by an NS388 and lose the portability of the smaller instrument. Am I missing something here?

Neither the NS3 own dynamics setting in the Piano section (it only affects the NS3 own keybed) nor the Extern settings (they affect the transmission of MIDI from the NS3 to external MIDI, not the in inbound ones) have anything to do when you use an external master keyboard to play the NS sounds. You need to check the velocity curve settings on the master i.e. how the master keybed data is "translated" to its MIDI OUT, so in your case you need to check the MP11 "Touch Curve" parameter of the zone used to control the NS3.

maxpiano wrote:Neither the NS3 own dynamics settin in the Piano section (it only affects the NS3 own keybed) nor the Extern settings (they affect the transmission of MIDI from the NS3 to external MIDI, not the in inbound ones) have anything to do when you use an external master keyboard to play the NS spunds. You need to check the velocity curve settings on the master i.e. how the master keybed data is "translated" to its MIDI OUT, so in your case you need to check the MP11 "Touch Curve" parameter of the zone used to control the NS3.

Aha! Thank you so much for pointing me toward this menu setting. I love my MP11 but I've always found its interface to be terribly confusing. However, I do want to gently point out that the touch/dynamics control of the piano panel on the Nord does, indeed, seem to affect the velocity curve even when playing with an external controller. Between the touch curve control on the Kawai and the 0-1-2-3 button on the Nord I seem to be able to get very nice adjustable curve and the combination of the Nord piano engine with the wooden action of the Kawai is just wondrous. Thanks again, I'm quite relieved.

Fallboard wrote:

maxpiano wrote:Neither the NS3 own dynamics settin in the Piano section (it only affects the NS3 own keybed) nor the Extern settings (they affect the transmission of MIDI from the NS3 to external MIDI, not the in inbound ones) have anything to do when you use an external master keyboard to play the NS spunds. You need to check the velocity curve settings on the master i.e. how the master keybed data is "translated" to its MIDI OUT, so in your case you need to check the MP11 "Touch Curve" parameter of the zone used to control the NS3.

Aha! Thank you so much for pointing me toward this menu setting. I love my MP11 but I've always found its interface to be terribly confusing. However, I do want to gently point out that the touch/dynamics control of the piano panel on the Nord does, indeed, seem to affect the velocity curve even when playing with an external controller. Between the touch curve control on the Kawai and the 0-1-2-3 button on the Nord I seem to be able to get very nice adjustable curve and the combination of the Nord piano engine with the wooden action of the Kawai is just wondrous. Thanks again, I'm quite relieved.

Actually, thinking twice, you are right about the Piano dynamics on the Nord Stage, because it is a setting at Section (sound generation) level, not MIDI; my statement was wrong, probably since I never change the Piano dynamics of a patch regardless if I play the NS directly or via master, I stand corrected

@Fallboard:
Thanks for your statement about the Mp11 and the stage 3. My idea was to do the same, to use the better piano action of the MP11 to control the very nice Piano section of the stage 3, so, now, I know it works well and how to do it....I'm relieved too, thanks again, I just need to buy both of them....
Sincerely

Fallboard wrote:So I have tried setting the velocity dynamics on the piano panel to the lowest setting (no LEDs lit) and the MIDI Keyb in "EXTERN" to "Hard" on both panels, or even "soft" and it doesn't seem to make much of a difference. I was trying to use my Kawai MP11 to control the piano sounds in my NS3 but no matter what, the velocity curve is just too sensitive and it's very hard to play softly with the weighted controller. I get better control just playing the SW waterfall keys straight. I was really hoping I could have the option of using an external keyboard for my NS3C, especially if I want to play a show where there's a lot of piano-heavy stuff, but not have to by an NS388 and lose the portability of the smaller instrument. Am I missing something here?

I too am having difficulties getting the velocity right with an external keyboard (using my NS3C). It appears to me the NS3C handles velocity curves differently than my NE5. My NE5 handles this perfectly. I agree the NS3C keyboard's SW action is amazingly great for sensitive and quiet sounds. This is a great surprise and I'm very happy to have chosen the NS3C over the 76 or 88 key version. I can use Pianoteq, which allows for great control over velocity curves, so I'm not in any major inconvenience. However, I am disappointed in the fact that I can't use my external weighted action keys to accurately control the dynamics of my Nord's piano fantastic piano samples. I need the NSC3; a single, lightweight keyboard to handle all of the short one-off gigs I get. It's invaluable. But there are longer or different types of gigs where plugging an external weighted keyboard would be very handy for me. I wonder if Nord could put a new parameter in their MIDI settings? I wouldn't want that if it meant losing the great dynamic control Nord has created with the SW key action. Meanwhile, I'll check out products from midisolutions.com.

Murphy wrote:

Fallboard wrote:So I have tried setting the velocity dynamics on the piano panel to the lowest setting (no LEDs lit) and the MIDI Keyb in "EXTERN" to "Hard" on both panels, or even "soft" and it doesn't seem to make much of a difference. I was trying to use my Kawai MP11 to control the piano sounds in my NS3 but no matter what, the velocity curve is just too sensitive and it's very hard to play softly with the weighted controller. I get better control just playing the SW waterfall keys straight. I was really hoping I could have the option of using an external keyboard for my NS3C, especially if I want to play a show where there's a lot of piano-heavy stuff, but not have to by an NS388 and lose the portability of the smaller instrument. Am I missing something here?

I too am having difficulties getting the velocity right with an external keyboard (using my NS3C). It appears to me the NS3C handles velocity curves differently than my NE5. My NE5 handles this perfectly. I agree the NS3C keyboard's SW action is amazingly great for sensitive and quiet sounds. This is a great surprise and I'm very happy to have chosen the NS3C over the 76 or 88 key version. I can use Pianoteq, which allows for great control over velocity curves, so I'm not in any major inconvenience. However, I am disappointed in the fact that I can't use my external weighted action keys to accurately control the dynamics of my Nord's piano fantastic piano samples. I need the NSC3; a single, lightweight keyboard to handle all of the short one-off gigs I get. It's invaluable. But there are longer or different types of gigs where plugging an external weighted keyboard would be very handy for me. I wonder if Nord could put a new parameter in their MIDI settings? I wouldn't want that if it meant losing the great dynamic control Nord has created with the SW key action. Meanwhile, I'll check out products from midisolutions.com.

To be fair, I had to kludge through velocity settings on both the Kawai and the Nord and it's hardly an ideal velocity curve and having had the Electro 5 I am glad I'm not imagining things, as I don't remember having any problems controlling its Piano section from my external 88 key keyboard. I think this might be something Nord should look into when the are adjusting the next firmware release.

I have tested (once) my NS3 Compact with Kawai CS-7 and I can confirm that there was something unusual with Compact's response to normal MIDI velocities. It seems to me that with Kawai's normal curve you'll get those high velocity samples too soon. I needed to use very heavy curve to get kind of a normal response. Maybe it's Compact (with its special keyboard) which handles midi somehow differently, I don't know. It would be interesting to test this with other Stage 3 models (HA88 or HP76), if they behave similarly. If it's like that, then NS3 is somehow unique in its piano's MIDI handling.

I am just thinking aloud here, more tests is needed to be sure what's happening. But for those who consider buying NS3 Compact (or 76/88) with external controller in mind should be careful with this and at least have a 88-controller with a good set of MIDI adjustments.

Ecaroh wrote:I have tested (once) my NS3 Compact with Kawai CS-7 and I can confirm that there was something unusual with Compact's response to normal MIDI velocities. It seems to me that with Kawai's normal curve you'll get those high velocity samples too soon. I needed to use very heavy curve to get kind of a normal response. Maybe it's Compact (with its special keyboard) which handles midi somehow differently, I don't know. It would be interesting to test this with other Stage 3 models (HA88 or HP76), if they behave similarly. If it's like that, then NS3 is somehow unique in its piano's MIDI handling.

I am just thinking aloud here, more tests is needed to be sure what's happening. But for those who consider buying NS3 Compact (or 76/88) with external controller in mind should be careful with this and at least have a 88-controller with a good set of MIDI adjustments.

Yes, exactly this, couldn't have said it better myself. I liked to think of my NSC3 as my powerful laptop for which the Kawai and studio monitors were the home "docking station," to use a computer metaphor. I'd definitely like to see Nord reevaluate the incoming MIDI handling of note velocity for the piano section. With the "Heavy+" setting on the Kawai and a 0 or sometimes 1 setting on the Piano Section of the NS3C, I can get a pretty nice velocity curve, but it makes me leery of buying a slim 88 key controller for gigging because, as you said, it wouldn't necessarily have that kind of fine adjustment of outgoing MIDI velocity.

Murphy wrote:

Fallboard wrote:So I have tried setting the velocity dynamics on the piano panel to the lowest setting (no LEDs lit) and the MIDI Keyb in "EXTERN" to "Hard" on both panels, or even "soft" and it doesn't seem to make much of a difference. I was trying to use my Kawai MP11 to control the piano sounds in my NS3 but no matter what, the velocity curve is just too sensitive and it's very hard to play softly with the weighted controller. I get better control just playing the SW waterfall keys straight. I was really hoping I could have the option of using an external keyboard for my NS3C, especially if I want to play a show where there's a lot of piano-heavy stuff, but not have to by an NS388 and lose the portability of the smaller instrument. Am I missing something here?

I too am having difficulties getting the velocity right with an external keyboard (using my NS3C). It appears to me the NS3C handles velocity curves differently than my NE5. My NE5 handles this perfectly. I agree the NS3C keyboard's SW action is amazingly great for sensitive and quiet sounds. This is a great surprise and I'm very happy to have chosen the NS3C over the 76 or 88 key version. I can use Pianoteq, which allows for great control over velocity curves, so I'm not in any major inconvenience. However, I am disappointed in the fact that I can't use my external weighted action keys to accurately control the dynamics of my Nord's piano fantastic piano samples. I need the NSC3; a single, lightweight keyboard to handle all of the short one-off gigs I get. It's invaluable. But there are longer or different types of gigs where plugging an external weighted keyboard would be very handy for me. I wonder if Nord could put a new parameter in their MIDI settings? I wouldn't want that if it meant losing the great dynamic control Nord has created with the SW key action. Meanwhile, I'll check out products from midisolutions.com.

I have the same problem...Today I received my NS3 Compact...great keyboard feel, I think it's different from my NE5D...much better feeling when I play piano or Rhodes...when I connect to my master keyboard Dopfer PK88 with hammer keys ( Doepfer has fixed velocity curve), piano sounds like I all the time playin hard, like all the time velocity is 120-127...
What to do now? Waiting for next firmware or find other solution?