Discuss other brands keyboards, synthesizers, modules, software, controllers including how they compare or work with the Nords.

Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave

Postby Lyonart » 23 Nov 2012, 14:56

Hi,

I am looking for a new second board to go with my Stage 2 88 and just wanted to see if anybody has any experience of using either of the above instruments.

I currently also have an Roland XP-30 and Novation KS5 which I am thinking of selling to get either a Nord Wave or Virus TI2 (or another yet unknown option if anyone can suggest anything else).

Whilst I really do like the Nord Wave and have briefly tried it in my local store, I am concerned that my Stage 2 is, in effect 60% of a Nord Wave and therefore the idea of a different (non Nord) board might open up my sound designing pallete rather than duplicating elements already present in the Stage.

I am really getting into sound designing and the Virus TI2 really looks like it would keep me entertained for many years to come. Whilst the Virus TI2 does not play samples, I have spotted that there is the option to feed audio into the Virus and use the filters and envelopes etc. This would alllow me to use samples from my Stage 2 and use outputs 3 and 4 to route synth, piano or organ sounds directly into the Virus and manipulate them in real-time.

I have really been giving thought to a second board for some time and have even considered buying older 'classic' boards like the D50, DX7II and JX3P.

Whilst I appreciate this is a Nord forum, any advice on the benefits/dis-benefits of an Access Virus TI2 compared to a Nord Wave would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers

Geoff
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Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave


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Re: Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave

Postby mjbrands » 23 Nov 2012, 18:30

I've had both the Stage 2, Wave and Virus (a TI, not a TI2, but that doesn't really matter in this case). If I had a Stage 2, I'd go for the Virus instead of the Wave (because of the reasons you mentioned).

If I didn't have a Stage 2, the decision would probably depend on whether I would be playing it live or also in a studio situation. I think the Wave would be best for a live situation (which the Virus TI also does well) and the Virus would be better in a studio situation. The TI standards for 'Total Integration' and the integration of the Virus (the hardware) into a DAW is better then any of the other synths I've seen.

For me, I'd choose the Virus TI both in the case where I had a Stage 2 and where I didn't. But I personally prefer mucking about in Ableton Live or Logic to playing a song in one go.

I'd say the build quality of the Virus and the Nords is about the same (both are excellent).

The Wave can do quite a bit more than the synth section of the Stage 2, but I think your 60% estimate isn't too bad. The Wave especially has more modulation options than the Stage 2's synth section. For someone who really, really likes the synth section of the Stage 2, getting a Wave might be a no-brainer.
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Re: Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave

Postby Lyonart » 23 Nov 2012, 21:49

Thanks mjbrands that's a really good insight from someone who has owned both boards.

Whilst I may well use the both the Stage 2 and (Virus or Wave) for gigs I will also use both at home. I am new to Ableton (I currently only have an older demo version) and may buy Version 9 which will open up some options for recording and making my own tracks, in which case the Virus might be the better bet.

What were the filters like on the Virus? I really like the filters on the Stage 2 - they are somehow warm and give an aura of quality and I imagine the Wave would be very similar in this regard. The filters are the only thing that dissappoints me about my KS5 in terms of the overall quality of the sound produced. Other than that its a very capable little rig for only £450 and I would be sad to see it go.

Clearly given the price being asked for the Wave and Virus (they are only about £200 apart in the market), the Virus seems to offer more capabilities for the money. It is a shame that Youtube is littered only with audio examples of a Virus at its most extreme. I like to produce more subtle nuances in my sound to go with my Stage 2 - can the Virus do 'soft'.

I think i really need to try out the Virus TI2 to make sure its the right board for me.
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Gear - [color=#000080]Nord Stage 2 HA88, Nord Drum 3P, Modal 002, Arturia Matrixbrute, Moog Sub37, Waldorf Blofeld, Arturia Drumbrute, Roland XP-30, Novation KS5, Soundcraft Ui24r., FX - 2 x Eventide H9, Oto Bam, Strymon Volante.
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Re: Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave

Postby Mr_-G- » 23 Nov 2012, 23:51

Tinpig wrote:... have even considered buying older 'classic' boards like the D50, DX7II and JX3P.


What about the jx8p? I think it is way-way better than the jx3p. Or a module like the xv-5080?

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Re: Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave

Postby mjbrands » 24 Nov 2012, 00:07

Tinpig wrote:Whilst I may well use the both the Stage 2 and (Virus or Wave) for gigs I will also use both at home. I am new to Ableton (I currently only have an older demo version) and may buy Version 9 which will open up some options for recording and making my own tracks, in which case the Virus might be the better bet.

If you're also interesting in sequencing older MIDI equipment, Logic might be a better choice than Ableton (if you have a Mac, that is). Ableton cannot handle MIDI SysEx messages and because of this, you can't include SysEx dumps of programs in your MIDI files (not that this works with new synths, but that's a different matter). Ableton Live makes more sense to me than Logic, but I suppose that Logic might be better for mixing/producing stuff while Live might be better for live setups.

Tinpig wrote:What were the filters like on the Virus? I really like the filters on the Stage 2 - they are somehow warm and give an aura of quality and I imagine the Wave would be very similar in this regard.

Well, the filters on the Virus aren't creamy smooth like a Moog. You have lets of different filter options, but in general they can sound somewhat harsh and digital. That said, I like the Waldorf filters (especially the comb filter) a lot and those sound even more digital. I would guess you can mimic the sound of the Stage 2's filter on the Virus, but I'm not sure nor have I tried it.

I thought the filter on the Stage 2 sounded better than the Wave's, but it might just be exactly the same filter.

Tinpig wrote:The filters are the only thing that dissappoints me about my KS5 in terms of the overall quality of the sound produced. Other than that its a very capable little rig for only £450 and I would be sad to see it go.

Well, whatever you do, don't trade it in for an Ultranova then. While the thing works fine (and the filter undoubtedly works better than on the older Novation synths), it somehow fails the impress (the sound). Maybe I should toss it on ebay and get an older Supernova II.

Tinpig wrote:Clearly given the price being asked for the Wave and Virus (they are only about £200 apart in the market), the Virus seems to offer more capabilities for the money.

A second-hand Virus TI (or TI2) might be an option. You can probably easily find units in excellent condition for maybe 50% of the price of a new TI2. The TI and TI2 still run the same software; the TI2 has 2-3 more knobs and gets about 25% more polyphony than the TI.

Tinpig wrote:It is a shame that Youtube is littered only with audio examples of a Virus at its most extreme. I like to produce more subtle nuances in my sound to go with my Stage 2 - can the Virus do 'soft'.

It can do 'soft', but don't look at the (tons) of presets that come with the thing. That's mostly trance-type stuff, laden in effects. (Effects is something the Virus does very well and it has lots and lots of them.)

The oscillators on the Virus (starting with the Virus A) would alias pretty badly in the higher registers, which made for a pretty raw and digital sound. On the Virus TI they added a lot of new oscillator types; the old ones are still there (they're called 'classic' now, I think) but the newer ones don't alias like that (they sound smoother). You can choose if you run the Virus at 44.1 or 48 KHz and by running at 48 KHz, you can increase the frequency at which the aliasing occurs and move some of that crap higher in the frequency band (where you might not be able to hear it). Anyway, I think they left in those aliasing oscillators, because it's part of that 'classic' Virus sound. A lot of virtual-analogs have issues with aliasing oscillators, but in a lot of cases they've intentionally left in oscillators that alias (in addition to ones that don't) - the Kurzweil synths (with their amazingly deep and hard to program synth-architecture) are an example of this.

This sounds pretty nice:


Granted, there's a version with a Moog Little Phatty and that does manage to sound more like a CS80 :lol:

Tinpig wrote:I think i really need to try out the Virus TI2 to make sure its the right board for me.

Maybe you know someone who has one and will let you borrow it for a few days? Like the Nords it is a really knobby synth and there's hardly any menu-diving involved but it does have lots of buttons, features and effects and is certainly quite a bit more difficult to use than a Nord. I think you either love or hate it and that goes for both the sound and the interface. For what it does, the Virus is rather expensive (as are the Nords). You can pretty much get the same sounds out of soft-synths (as with the Nords), but personally I prefer knobs over a mouse. The Waldorf Blofeld can also sound quite a bit like the Virus, but the hardware (and software) quality of modern Waldorf synths can't really compete with the Virus; then again, it costs 4-6x less. The Virus certainly has a better user-interface than the Blofeld and I'd say it is also easier to program. The (PC) software for the Virus was pretty crappy and unstable in the past, but then I'm talking about years ago. I never had any crashes or hangs (I did with the Blofeld).

While the Virus can input and output audio via USB, there are some issues. It has issues with some USB chipsets and it does not like it when it shares a USB port with other devices - the sound will 'stutter' if you run in to this. The software that comes with the Virus checks for this and warns you about this, if it detects issues (on a Mac this is less of a problem). For the best sound quality you should use the regular outputs; the thing has very good AD and DA convertors. Of course, the Wave doesn't even output sound via USB, so I suppose that would just be a nice bonus on the Virus.

Edit: this one has some interesting sounds and it also shows the interface.

Last edited by mjbrands on 24 Nov 2012, 00:24, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave

Postby Lyonart » 24 Nov 2012, 02:06

Mr_-G- wrote:
Tinpig wrote:... have even considered buying older 'classic' boards like the D50, DX7II and JX3P.


What about the jx8p? I think it is way-way better than the jx3p. Or a module like the xv-5080?


Yes, I have considered a module - The Integra-7 looks quite good with a fantastic range of presets but from what I here the programming is currently limited in certain areas and there is no dedicated editor app other than on the Ipad.

Mjbrands thank you again for your great input regarding the Virus. I think I must try one out and will check my local store (although not sure they stcok Access products).

Geoff :thumbup:
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Re: Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave

Postby pablomastodon » 24 Nov 2012, 18:18

if programming entertainment is what you're looking for, you can't beat a Nord Modular G2...
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Re: Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave

Postby Mr_-G- » 24 Nov 2012, 20:38

Can one still get one of those new? I never seen one myself, but tried the emulator software and it is really cool.
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Re: Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave

Postby Lyonart » 24 Nov 2012, 22:12

pablomastodon wrote:if programming entertainment is what you're looking for, you can't beat a Nord Modular G2...


Yeah the G2 looks great but getting hold of one is not easy these days as they are not available new and good examples on ebay are hard to find.

Given the liklihood that most new pcs/laptops will have a touch screen as standard I can see Nord and other manufacturers pursuing new models along the lines of the G2 but with touch screen capability. Korg have already released many touch operated programs on the Ipad (such as the iMS-20 and Electribe) and if the Windows 8 platform is stable enough, it may just provide a basis for designing some great new apps.

Given the alleged reluctance of Apple to allow Nord to use the Ipad to enable downloading of samples etc, this may be to the benefit of other platforms such as Windows 8. I personally prefer playing on hardware but being able to have a software/hardware based keyboard for sound design purposes would be great.

In many ways the Access Virus already has that capability with the 'Total Integration' between hardware and software and touch operation may take this to a whole new level.

Geoff
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Gear - [color=#000080]Nord Stage 2 HA88, Nord Drum 3P, Modal 002, Arturia Matrixbrute, Moog Sub37, Waldorf Blofeld, Arturia Drumbrute, Roland XP-30, Novation KS5, Soundcraft Ui24r., FX - 2 x Eventide H9, Oto Bam, Strymon Volante.
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Re: Access Virus TI2 vs Nord Wave

Postby mjbrands » 25 Nov 2012, 16:44

Tinpig wrote:if the Windows 8 platform is stable enough, it may just provide a basis for designing some great new apps.

As much as I don't like Windows 8, it does seem like a very good platform for music applications, especially stuff meant for tablets.
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