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technlgyst wrote:Sure. In the end it's "just" specific MIDI messages that trigger the pedal noises, so any smartphone app or computer software that can send MIDI messages over CC64 has the potential to trigger the pedal noises. However, Nord doesn't simply use all values 0..127 on CC64 in a continuous and linear manner when pressing a pedal: there are some triggering values and some sound-producing value ranges. I implemented that in the app. Therefore I'm not sure what happens when you would use the physical alternative you purpose. I guess in that case a continuous foot controller triggers the sending of CC64, but in a linear way, so 0 when not depressed, 64 when depressed halfway, and 127 when fully depressed (and everything in between). That's not going to give you the pedal sound that Nord intended.
About the app being an approximation: it cannot detect pedal positions indeed, so it's still on and off. As an alternative, it uses your playing velocity to control the specific pedal sounds that are played in a sequence, corresponding to a higher or lower velocity pedal press. Fixed volume is also possible though.
About how Nord uses continuous MIDI CC64 values coming from an external source, of course we don't know for sure but I assume the Nord firmware can easily translate those into its standard discrete levels. What I know for sure is that I have been using a Nord Stage 2/3 compact driven by an external weighted master + continuous pedal for years and Pedal Noise triggering seems to work correctly (even just for test, as on the Nord I tend to keep it switched off, not really useful in a band situation and at home I prefer to use a Virtual Piano if I want a full/better simulation).
Back to the app, I understand the idea to extrapolate the pedal velocity from (average I guess) notes velocity, but that's again an approximation (the player could be well playing a fff with the hands but not doing the same with the foot)
Last edited by maxpiano on 25 Mar 2024, 10:44, edited 3 times in total.
I see a little problem with the target group:
Those who play in a heavy band context will probably be perfectly fine without pedal noise - the cleaner the sound, the better: no string resonance, no pedal noise.
Those who play in a small jazz combo or solo will probably want true pedal noise and may use a triple pedal.
So there is only those in between who might be interested in this virtual pedal noise invention. Or people like me who play a piano based ballad in their band every now and then and would like to shine.
You are right. I guess it's everybody's personal consideration whether it is interesting to them to have pedal noises. I like it when playing at home or during isolated piano parts, for the more immersive and realistic playing experience, which makes me feel more connected to the instrument. Therefore, I leave it always on, also in a general band context, even though it's probably barely noticable over the PA system. I'd say it can be interesting for players at home, or recording/studio artists.
maxpiano wrote:Back to the app, I understand the idea to extrapolate the pedal velocity from (average I guess) notes velocity, but that's again an approximation (the player could be well playing a fff with the hands but not doing the same with the foot)
True, it remains an approximation, but that's the only relevant thing left in one's performance from which some information can be distilled. I think there is more often than not a positive correlation between the playing velocity and the pedalling velocity. I've never encountered nor can I imagine playing PPP but needing FFF pedal velocity.
maxpiano wrote:Back to the app, I understand the idea to extrapolate the pedal velocity from (average I guess) notes velocity, but that's again an approximation (the player could be well playing a fff with the hands but not doing the same with the foot)
True, it remains an approximation, but that's the only relevant thing left in one's performance from which some information can be distilled. I think there is more often than not a positive correlation between the playing velocity and the pedalling velocity. I've never encountered nor can I imagine playing PPP but needing FFF pedal velocity.
Actually in some type of situations you could, imagine in some kind of "intimate" ballad piano playing, you may want to make the pedal noise explicitly audible and even prevalent in a ppp passage (for example holding a chord and bouncing the pedal as if it was a kind of hi-hat while the main sound decays).
Anyway I agree with you that the logic you implemented is the only viable alternative, with the available MIDI data.
Last edited by maxpiano on 25 Mar 2024, 17:24, edited 4 times in total.