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NS3 Organ - not so good (but I'm making it better i think)

Postby kbmatson » 15 Nov 2018, 21:02

Well - I've been dreading this post - or rather - the testing reality that leads to this post. I'm an old "Hammond Guy" - started with an M3 in the seventies, and since have had 2 B3s, C3, A100 currently, and multiple Leslie's including 145, 147, 122, and 251. I've also had many clones over the years including ones from Univox, Roland, Oberheim, and Korg, and suffered through the laughable attempts many of my generic synths made at Hammond. I play in a little blues/classic rock band and am an old fart. I also own/run a pro recording studio.http://www.soundworksrp.com . I know my Hammonds and Hammond "sounds".

The one clone organ that has made me pretty happy was/is my Korg CX3 - this one is part of the second wave of them made in the mid 2000s. It does a dang good Hammond, reasonable Leslie effect, and weighs a lot less than my A100! The problem is that it is ONLY an organ, so I still have to take out something else for piano and synth. I recently (< 2 months) bought an NS3 Compact. My goals were to get down to one, lightweight keyboard that "did everything well" - meaning piano, organ,and synth - and was performance oriented vs workstation oriented. NS3 seemed to fit the bill, so I splurged on it. The physical drawbars and waterfall keys tickled my Hammond fancy too.

When I first got it. I felt a little underwhelmed at the organ, which is one of the main things that I was hoping would be "killer" on it, but it just didn't sound "right" to me. I didn't have the CX3 around to compare too, and the A100 is sickly at the moment, but from what I felt and could remember in my head - the NS3 just wasn't impressing me. Anyway - i adjusted the settings and figured it was just a matter of getting things set right and getting used to it. I happily went my way for multiple gigs over the next month and a half, and the NS3 did OK - covering what i wanted in having piano/organ/synth, split keyboards, layers, etc. That part - real-time controls, etc. and frankly, most of the piano and synth sounds are great.

So today - for the first time, I had the NS3 and the CX3 both in the studio, both set-up, right on top of each other, at the same time ... and .... to my horror - but not really to my surprise given the above, my $500, 10-12 year old CX3 (if it's even worth that any more) just blows my $3500, brand new NS3 away on Hammond, :-(

Maybe if i get some time, I'll record and post some audio samples, but the Korg is so much clearer - sharper - as far as cutting through at every frequency. The NS3 sounds - I dunno - muffled? in comparison. My first impression was that the CX3 was just a lot brighter, but honestly - it's across the board - for example - the low end of the CX3 also blows the NS3 out and makes it sound like a Casio bought from Walmart. I keep hoping maybe I've got some sort of setting wrong or something, but can't find anything. The NS3 has this low-mid presence that is really annoying, and the upper drawbars just don't "cut". Also - the leakage/cross talk in the Korg is much more pronounced than the NS3 - and yes I do have it set to Vintage 2. I am running OS 1.52 by the way.

Not sure what I "want" here except for maybe someone else to tell me I'm not (or I am) crazy? Hopefully this is something that can be addressed somewhere down the line via update, but for now, I'm quite depressed with my $3500 purchase.

KenM
Last edited by kbmatson on 16 Nov 2018, 00:52, edited 1 time in total.
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NS3 Organ - not so good (but I'm making it better i think)


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Re: NS3 Organ - it ain't so good ...

Postby aureliopenna » 15 Nov 2018, 21:25

Man, Why you didn't test it before buying!?? Didn't you hear demos on-line?

Many people feels like NS3 has (until 1.52 OS) a "wrong", thin, annoying and at least poor B3 (and leslie). If organ was your main thing you just could go to NS2 which sound much "honest" IN MY OPINION (I had both).
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Re: NS3 Organ - it ain't so good ...

Postby Music*aL » 15 Nov 2018, 21:49

Just curious, which of the Leslie sims are you using? This alone can make a huge difference. Also, are you running your B3 sound through the available EQ? That also helps. Finally, some find that the distortion in the EQ section is smoother (for lack of a better word) than that in the Leslie sim section.

HTH,

aL
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Re: NS3 Organ - it ain't so good ...

Postby kbmatson » 15 Nov 2018, 21:50

I did listen to MANY demos online - not a lot of pure NS3 organ demos available - but a lot of C2D - and supposedly it's the same?

since my post above, I've gone back to it with fresh ears/mind, and it's not as bad as I had originally thought maybe. the NS3 organ does have some redeeming qualities.

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Re: NS3 Organ - it ain't so good ...

Postby kbmatson » 15 Nov 2018, 21:53

Music*aL wrote:Just curious, which of the Leslie sims are you using? This alone can make a huge difference. Also, are you running your B3 sound through the available EQ? That also helps. Finally, some find that the distortion in the EQ section is smoother (for lack of a better word) than that in the Leslie sim section.

HTH,

aL


using the 122 Close - and 60/40 in favor of horn. vintage 2.

Actually the Leslie Drive I'm pretty happy with - I think that sounds fairly authentic. The EQ/Amp distortion is fine if you want to simulate the John Lord playing through a guitar head thing. I may have to play with actual EQ a bit to see if I can solve that low-mid thing a bit and get the highs to cut a bit more.
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Re: NS3 Organ - it ain't so good ...

Postby analogika » 15 Nov 2018, 22:00

Interesting. I needed to set it 60/40 in favor of rotor to feel comfortable with it. (122 Close also)
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Re: NS3 Organ - it ain't so good ...

Postby kbmatson » 15 Nov 2018, 22:25

analogika wrote:Interesting. I needed to set it 60/40 in favor of rotor to feel comfortable with it. (122 Close also)


I'm trying to get the highs to cut - but yeah - the btm does suffer a bit
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Re: NS3 Organ - it ain't so good ...

Postby Music*aL » 15 Nov 2018, 22:48

Sounds like you've ticked all the possible boxes. Maybe that EQ will help with the mud.

FWIW, the speakers you play the Nords through can make a huge difference in the quality of the sound. I use Event near field monitors in my home studio and a QSC K10 speaker live that I sometime supplement with a second yamaha speaker (I run my rig mono all the time). The Nords sound best through the near field monitors of course. The B3 live sounds very good. My only complaint is the low output for which I now use a mixer to boost.

I know different ears hear things differently and we each are looking for (or listening for) a particular B3 sound. For me, the NS3 B3 sound is great (not perfect of course --it's only a clone after all). I have the NS2 and can barely stomach it without a ventilator and really don't like the way the C/V sounds at all, especially C3. The NS3 "fixed" the sim and C/V issues and compared to the NS2 has beefed up the B3 sound especially with Vintage 2. I also have the Mojo 61 and still prefer the NS3. Different strokes of course!!

Hope you are able to get the sound you're after out of your NS3...

aL
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Re: NS3 Organ - it ain't so good ...

Postby kbmatson » 15 Nov 2018, 23:02

i have Event Opals in studio and also play through a K10 live.
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Re: NS3 Organ - it ain't so good ...

Postby Music*aL » 15 Nov 2018, 23:21

Good taste in speakers!
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