Nord User Forum

[bitflipper]

Thanks, everyone, for the insights and opinions.

For years I used a Yamaha MO8 with a Hammond XK-1, exactly for the reasons stated above: one feels like a piano and one feels like an organ. But I don't like stacking keyboards because it's too hard to see the control panel on the lower instrument. Setting them up at 90 degrees on the same plane solves that, but then I take up too much space on small stages. When I bought the Kronos my hope was to do it all with one synth. Sound-wise, it does work for that. But playing organ on the Kronos is painful. After this conversation I'm thinking I might go back to two keyboards for gigs when it's practical and make do with just the NS3 when it isn't.

Fortunately, my band does 60's and 70's rock/pop/funk covers, so I'm doing 75% pianos and EPs, 20% organ, 5% horns and the occasional synth lead if the audience is amenable to the anachronism (meaning drunk enough not to notice that House of the Rising Sun didn't have a synth in it). Many synths can cover those basic needs, and I think the NS3 will do fine. Only the brass is noticeably weaker, but in context and accompanied by a sax, I think it'll suffice.

Setup time can be a major factor. When you play single-stage festivals, for example, you may have only 10 minutes to set up. It's one of the reasons I've tried to streamline everything. Gone are the multi-fx stompbox, the Ventilator and separate mixer. Used to run in stereo, now I'm all mono - for multiple reasons, one of which is a simpler setup (still use 2 amps but they're daisy-chained).

As for using software-based instruments, I tried that for a few weeks and decided against it after accidentally dumping my laptop onto the floor a couple times. I mostly used Keyscape's EPs, Omnisphere pads and VB3 for organ. All sounded great, but in the end I decided that depending on a computer on stage was just too risky. Maybe if I had a rack-mounted PC...

[anotherscott]

I don't like stacking keyboards because it's too hard to see the control panel on the lower instrument.

That depends on how deep the control panel is on your bottom board, and how flexible your stand is in either placing your top board somewhat behind (but possibly only slightly higher than) your bottom board, or possibly alternatively, less far behind but instead somewhat higher, whichever you prefer. So this problem really varies based on the boards and the stand, and should always be able to be addressed from one side or the other. Changing your stand is generally the best way to go, since you may love your boards, plus changing a stand is usually a lot cheaper than changing a board!

Setup time can be a major factor. When you play single-stage festivals, for example, you may have only 10 minutes to set up.

Yes. Quick turnaround situations are one of the few times I'll choose to play just one board. There are also, for example, people who get to their gigs via mass transit, where traveling light is at a premium.

As for using software-based instruments, I tried that for a few weeks and decided against it after accidentally dumping my laptop onto the floor a couple times. I mostly used Keyscape's EPs, Omnisphere pads and VB3 for organ. All sounded great, but in the end I decided that depending on a computer on stage was just too risky. Maybe if I had a rack-mounted PC...

Or instead of a rack-mounted PC, you could look at a tablet like a Surface Pro. It's usually easy to somehow secure a tablet somewhere, whether to your keyboard, your stand, to your mic stand if you sing... with the explosion of iPads at gigs, there are numerous common ways to do this.

[bitflipper]

You've given me more to think about. I've seriously considered the K&M Spider Pro, but when I've used that style of stand in the past I found them too wobbly. Using an X-style stand now, which is rock solid even when I'm rocking myself.

I hadn't thought about getting a more compact laptop/tablet. Something to consider. Although I gave up using a tablet at gigs (for set lists and lyrics) because it was so hard to find a good place for it. My setup's pretty crowded. I use a QSC K8.2 as a monitor, on a stand to one side. The mic stand already holds a VoiceLive unit. Plus I have a mixer on my left to manage the vocal mix. Sometimes it's all I can do just to keep things from falling off the edge of the stage and keeping my elbows out of the way of the drummer's ride cymbal. I guess I could get the Nord music stand attachment, but people complain they can't see me as it is.

I'd love to hear from anyone using a Spider-style stand who thinks that's the way to go. I've only used the cheaper Apex and OnStage stands.

[anotherscott]

I'm a fan of the K&M 18880, and the 18881 stacker for the second tier. It's super-light, collapses and sets-up in seconds, moves in one piece. IT works with any 2-board config I've envisioned... the 18881 stacker can go high enough if you need height to access the bottom board, OR you can flip it backwards if you want to put the top board more "behind" the first board than "above" it. (Sometimes people drill holes in the stems of the 18881 to create lower possible positions... just make sure whatever you do on ones side is identical on the other!)

[Amadrius]

I have used a K&M spider pro for years. Works great with my Stage 3 compact and Wave 2. I also have the K&M tablet holder that connects to the spider pro. It’s a very solid and compact rig, but I don’t know how it would hold up with an 88 key keyboard.

[bitflipper]

I've decided to pull the trigger on the K&M, the 2-tier version because I'll have to continue using the Kronos until I've had time to fully integrate the NS3 into the band.

Thanks again for all the insights!

[DJKeys]

I'm a fan of the K&M 18880, and the 18881 stacker for the second tier. It's super-light, collapses and sets-up in seconds, moves in one piece. IT works with any 2-board config I've envisioned... the 18881 stacker can go high enough if you need height to access the bottom board, OR you can flip it backwards if you want to put the top board more "behind" the first board than "above" it. (Sometimes people drill holes in the stems of the 18881 to create lower possible positions... just make sure whatever you do on ones side is identical on the other!)

+1 for this choice. I had the Baby Spider Pro with two tiers, and it was just too heavy. The 18880/18881 combination is more stable and super light, set up and tear down takes literally seconds.

-dj

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[Guynextdoor]

I hear ya. I've had my power cut off a few times, once during a performance by a drunken bar patron and once right before we were supposed to start, when the guitarist decided to move some extension cords at the last moment. Had to tell some jokes, and I am not much of a joke-teller.

What did you do with your Kronos? Keep it for studio work, or sell it?

Sold it. Got my bread and butter sounds on the NS3 so I didn't need it. Plus, I keep my rig light. Unlike other musicians I don't suffer from GAS.

[hoopyfrood]

I have used a K&M spider pro for years. Works great with my Stage 3 compact and Wave 2. I also have the K&M tablet holder that connects to the spider pro. It’s a very solid and compact rig, but I don’t know how it would hold up with an 88 key keyboard.

I used to regularly use a K&M Spider Pro with a Kronos 73 and Triton Studio 88 - total weight around 50kg, and it was perfectly reliable and solid.

[PScooter63]

I've decided to pull the trigger on the K&M, the 2-tier version because I'll have to continue using the Kronos until I've had time to fully integrate the NS3 into the band.

Thanks again for all the insights!

Don’t overlook anotherscott’s suggestion of an uninterruptible power supply for your Kronos. Back in the day when I was doing theater pit work with my Kurzweil K2600, a UPS was my best friend. I couldn’t afford even a minute of down time.

(As to whether to sell your Kronos or not, I offer my K2600 as a word to the wise… I nostalgically hung onto it until it was too late, there was no demand for it by the time I got around to seriously contemplating selling it. I haven’t booted it for at least six years.)