NORD GRAND KEYBED: customized RH3

[Mr_-G-]

Really you should try it personally. No amount of information on whether the keybed has been modified really matters if you do not like the result. Impressions are subjective and this is an expensive instrument to just rely on somebody else's perception.

[Rychubil]

Really you should try it personally. No amount of information on whether the keybed has been modified really matters if you do not like the result. Impressions are subjective and this is an expensive instrument to just rely on somebody else's perception.

Absolutely agree! If you still consider to buy Nord Grand, obligatory you must to try it. Everyone impressions can be different. BTW playing on RH-N with nord samples is completely different than on RHIII with Kawai sound engine.
P.S. don't compare Fatar noisy and clicky actions on NS3 or NP4 with NG - different world of touch, action and noise/silent.

[GuiliClayder]

Will have to wait until October then, the Nord Grand isn't available until then in my country...

[Rychubil]

No way, you have to wait.

[nordkeys]

I'm in the process of deciding between the Kawai MP11SE or VPC1, paired with a Dexibell Vivo SX7 sound module, or a Nord Grand.
Haven't played the Grand yet, but I have played the MP7SE. And while the keybed is really good, it's nothing like the MP11SE or VPC1.

There's no way of knowing in what way Kawai's RHIII keybed has been customized for Nord, so I'm hoping someone here can tell me. I like the feel and touch of the MP7SE, but the keybed isn't completely silent.

Check this :


I know that the Fatar keybeds used in the Stage 3 and Piano 4, for example, aren't very good, and noisy. But hoping that someone can make an objective comparison between the Nord Grand and the MP11SE/VPC1 as far as keybed noise is concerned. The Kawai MP7SE is a LOT quieter than the Piano 4, for example, but I'm kind of hoping that Nord has modified the keybed to make it near silent.
It's rather simple : if the Nord Grand isn't as quiet as the VP1 or MP11SE, I'm not buying it. Makes sense : the Nord Grand is a very expensive piece of kit, so I think it's normal that we as customers expect nothing but the best...

I have a Nord Grand, and tried out the MP11SE before I bought it. I can't speak for the noise because it just isn't loud enough for me to care, but to me, the action on the Nord Grand is more responsive than the MP11SE.

[sweelinck]

If you want the best translation of practice sessions to a 9’ concert grand, the Kawai Grand Feel (GF) action of the MP11SE is superior to the RH-3 action. But the RH-3 action is excellent in its own right, with very responsive repetition speed and ability to support fast passage work, trills, and rapid staccatos. The GF action does not suffer from the key bounce issue when releasing notes that is noticeable on all versions of the RH-3 action, which is the source of action noise.

Per Kawai tech support, Clavia employees found a couple of minor improvements to the RH-3 action in their testing. These were incorporated into the version of the action Kawai supplies to Clavia, and likely will find their way into future (versions of) Kawai keyboards with the action.

[jbolazzi]

The action is in fact lighter and faster than the MP11SE but not realistic versus real accoustic piano. This is a great instrument to be used as a stage piano but it is not appropriate for studying piano and developping piano technique.

[LewTheKeysGuy]

from my side of things, considering I rely on my hands completely as a blind pianist, I've worked with a heck of a lot of acoustic and digital pianos, a variety of pie organs both pure and digital, so actions are instantly noticeable to me. Having the stage 3-88 and Nord Grand, the Grand is absolute pure heaven, I've tried the Kawai MP11SE, it's too heavy to transport, yes the action's nice, but believe it or not, for me, the Grand has the sexiest action possible, it's better than the Korg RH3 and Roland's version recently added to the Fantom and the LX series pianos. there's a nice strike and return action and doesn't feel clunky unlike some I can think of.

I really have a problem with certain piano actions, the actions I talk about are those where the piano (digital or acoustic) have ben abused and neglected. There's nothing worse than sitting at a piano to play good material to feel restricted by poor key travel, dried out actions, damp actions, failed return weights, etc. An example would be a local church's Yamaha Clavinova from the mid 80's. The action is that bad, I'm dying to bring service tools, open it up, completely re-grease all points, new felts and clean throughout, but it's not worth it because the main board shorts due to a broken sustain control input (not jack but a rather unusual din connection). other than re-soldering / reflowing it, it's a piano that sounds so bad, even a toy casio has class. I'm trying to convince the church to replace it with something better, even a Nord Grand / Piano 4 with a custom built case between myself and a cabinet maker friend.

from my perspective, the custom key bed design of the Grand is just perfect, but that's me, you don't have to take my word for it.

lew

[musicaldudeist]

[...] but it is not appropriate for studying piano and developping piano technique.

Can you explain why you think it's not good for studying piano and developing piano technique? The Grand action is better than the acoustic upright piano I take lessons on with my teacher. Since actions vary significantly on acoustic pianos, which acoustic pianos are sufficient for "studying piano and learning piano techniqiue"?

[jbolazzi]

[...] but it is not appropriate for studying piano and developping piano technique.

Can you explain why you think it's not good for studying piano and developing piano technique? The Grand action is better than the acoustic upright piano I take lessons on with my teacher. Since actions vary significantly on acoustic pianos, which acoustic pianos are sufficient for "studying piano and learning piano techniqiue"?

Don't get me wrong .The new NP key bed is not bad at all and you can certainly enjoy it for studying piano. My comment concerns only musiciens that have to practice daily to prepare themselves for top performance acoustic piano LIVE Concerts or studio recording, Since the NP key bed is on the light side of the range in term of mechanic I wouldn't personally recommend it for training if you are one of these musiciens. There is a lot of litterature on this topic from classical pianists preferring heavier mechanical key bed (Kawai MP11 or VPC1 for example) instruments for practicing so that their performance doesn't get altered and to get confortable when they have to play LIVE on an acoustic piano with heavier touch key board.( I am just sharing my experience being myself a Jazz piano player often exposed to all different type of acoustic piano in jazz clubs and others..). I got a chance to play the NP for 2 hours and I enjoyed it very much. I would personally buy it as a stage piano for LIVE playing but not for my daily practice.