Nord User Forum

[IHaveQuestions]

I do not think I would buy a new virus now, but instead wait for the Waldorf Kyra module (supposed to be out at NAMM 19) .
I agree that you should have a look at the MODX8.

Does it ever stop? lol.

I've done so much research, and the more I think I know, the more I realize I don't.

For instance, as of Thursday, I was convinced the V-Synth GT was the best thing since sliced bread. The Access Virus Ti2 replaced that today, and now you're talking about YET another board I haven't heard of before. If you don't mind, why about this Waldorf Kyra is worth waiting until NAMM '19, in your opinion?

I guess it is a good problem to have so many options, but my inane 'quest for perfection' combined with my time crunch is going to have me in a fetal position before it's all done.

Since I created this topic, I've had people suggesting the greatest thing in life I could do is learn to incorporate a laptop, because these hardware boards don't come close to the quality of software. That's too much to digest right now.

[Mr_-G-]

The Kyra It seems to be what the Virus TI3 should have been.
Here is an interview with the creator (when it was still called Valkyrie):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfhb0uA8N0A

Apparently the technology behind the Virus will be discontinued, which makes everybody wonder if there will be any further investment.
This article is also interesting:
https://synthmorph.com/blogs/news/acces ... -virus-ti3

[anotherscott]

From everything I reading, the best all-in-one boards - in regards to the broad range of sounds - around are the Montage, Genos, Jupiter 80, Kronos, Stage 3, and Forte?

I forgot about Genos, looks like a great board, I don't know much about it. I didn't have interest in buying a $5500 board.

VERY broadly speaking, you could say that Montage, Kronos, and Forte are birds of a feather, despite some significant differences. They will all cover all the b&b stuff pretty well.

NS3 is a little different... fewer sounds than any of those, very strong in some sounds and features as discussed, but not in the league of the others when it comes to strings, brass, winds, etc.

Jupiter 80 is also different. Far fewer acoustic instrument sounds than that first batch, though the ones they have ("SuperNatural acoustic tones") incorporate behavior modeling giving them some other attributes that you don't get out of straight sampling. Jupiter 80 non-synth sounds are:

piano
tine EP
reed EP
clav
organ
acoustic bass
electric bass
acoustic guitar
vibes
marimba
harp
sitar
accordions
harmonica
tympani
solo brass (trumpet, trombone, french horn, saxes, etc.)
winds (oboe, bassoon, clarinets, piccolo, flutes)
solo strings (violin, viola, cello)

It's a good list, but not comprehensive of every common sound one might be after. Some of the "missing" sounds may be approximated with the synth section, but they will not sound as "real" as sampled instruments. So for example, if you're looking for realistic choir voices, or harpsichord, or mellotron, you're not going to find it on the Jupiter 80.

BTW, if you like the Roland sounds but don't want to dedicate one of your two boards to them, you can get their Integra 7 module, which has all the Jupiter 80 sounds (barring some effects combinations) and many more, and you can drive that from one of your other boards.

I've seen people talk up the Jupiter 80's ability to sound big because of all of the stacking.

You can stack on other boards as well, but the Jupiter 80 interface may more easily lend itself to it, plus it has the 256 polyphony. This stacking is more useful for synth stuff. It could be a nice choice for you top board.

Also, shouldn't the Jupiter 80 basically be a Roland FA on steroids? How do you feel about the Jupiter 80 over the FA?

As a *synth* the Jupiter 80 is a better FA... same SuperNatural synth, but better editing display, more fx flexibility, nicer action. OTOH, it's a very different animal when it comes to the acoustic tones. The only SuperNatural acoustic tones teh FA has from the Jupiter 80 are

piano
tine EP
reed EP
clav
organ
acoustic bass
electric bass
acoustic guitar

plus one that's not in the Jupiter 80, Ensemble Strings.

OTOH, the FA has a whole lot of non-SuperNatural acoustic tones, so it doesn't have that "gap" that the Jupiter 80 has... it has all the sounds of the old XV-5080 and you can load additional sounds from up to two SRX expansions. For the most part, I wouldn't say these sounds are Montage/Kronos calibre, but there's still a lot of usable stuff if needed. (BTW, the Integra module has these as well.)

[IHaveQuestions]

From everything I reading, the best all-in-one boards - in regards to the broad range of sounds - around are the Montage, Genos, Jupiter 80, Kronos, Stage 3, and Forte?

I forgot about Genos, looks like a great board, I don't know much about it. I didn't have interest in buying a $5500 board.

VERY broadly speaking, you could say that Montage, Kronos, and Forte are birds of a feather, despite some significant differences. They will all cover all the b&b stuff pretty well.

NS3 is a little different... fewer sounds than any of those, very strong in some sounds and features as discussed, but not in the league of the others when it comes to strings, brass, winds, etc.

Jupiter 80 is also different. Far fewer acoustic instrument sounds than that first batch, though the ones they have ("SuperNatural acoustic tones") incorporate behavior modeling giving them some other attributes that you don't get out of straight sampling. Jupiter 80 non-synth sounds are:

piano
tine EP
reed EP
clav
organ
acoustic bass
electric bass
acoustic guitar
vibes
marimba
harp
sitar
accordions
harmonica
tympani
solo brass (trumpet, trombone, french horn, saxes, etc.)
winds (oboe, bassoon, clarinets, piccolo, flutes)
solo strings (violin, viola, cello)

It's a good list, but not comprehensive of every common sound one might be after. Some of the "missing" sounds may be approximated with the synth section, but they will not sound as "real" as sampled instruments. So for example, if you're looking for realistic choir voices, or harpsichord, or mellotron, you're not going to find it on the Jupiter 80.

BTW, if you like the Roland sounds but don't want to dedicate one of your two boards to them, you can get their Integra 7 module, which has all the Jupiter 80 sounds (barring some effects combinations) and many more, and you can drive that from one of your other boards.

I've seen people talk up the Jupiter 80's ability to sound big because of all of the stacking.

You can stack on other boards as well, but the Jupiter 80 interface may more easily lend itself to it, plus it has the 256 polyphony. This stacking is more useful for synth stuff. It could be a nice choice for you top board.

Also, shouldn't the Jupiter 80 basically be a Roland FA on steroids? How do you feel about the Jupiter 80 over the FA? /quote]
As a *synth* the Jupiter 80 is a better FA... same SuperNatural synth, but better editing display, more fx flexibility, nicer action. OTOH, it's a very different animal when it comes to the acoustic tones. The only SuperNatural acoustic tones teh FA has from the Jupiter 80 are

piano
tine EP
reed EP
clav
organ
acoustic bass
electric bass
acoustic guitar

plus one that's not in the Jupiter 80, Ensemble Strings.

OTOH, the FA has a whole lot of non-SuperNatural acoustic tones, so it doesn't have that "gap" that the Jupiter 80 has... it has all the sounds of the old XV-5080 and you can load additional sounds from up to two SRX expansions. For the most part, I wouldn't say these sounds are Montage/Kronos calibre, but there's still a lot of usable stuff if needed. (BTW, the Integra module has these as well.)

Ok. Then I'll probably go Montage as a bottom board, and perhaps a Jupiter 80 as a top. What that doesn't cover just won't get covered. lol.

Thanks a million.

[Quai34]

Well, I want the the very best of the best in bread and butter sounds and synth + bass sounds for a top board... Is what you suggest the best there is?

To some extent, this will always be subjective. But I would also say it may not be possible to get the best of everything in only two boards. Are you willing to go to more, or do you want the best 2 board compromise? Can you prioritize which the most important sounds are for you? Do you like to manipulate sounds as you play, or is it fine to just call up presets and pretty much play them as is? Also, budget may not be an issue, but do you have a weight limit on how heavy a board can be?

Great question and great answer from anotherscott as usual:
10 years ago, when I came back to music after a 10 years gap, I asked the same question and received the same answer by guys from the forum, from Pablo the Nord Rep for North America and from the rep in my store.
So, I bought the Stage 2 knowing that, even if it was a good all around B&B sound it was not the best In organ or Symth or Rompler.
Then, it was my plan to add a C2 and a Nord Lead 2X and some Rompler quite older at that time....And I did that.
For Rompler, even if the "all in the box" was starting to be the norm for certain people, I went used with an XV5080 fully loaded, an EMU Proteus Fully loaded and I was good enough on sounds to pair with the Stage 2 especially in a live settings...
Even Sax from the XV that are not top notch compare to what you could have now was good enough for my bandmate to tell me that it was sounded like the year before with a real sax player
So, a pure synth plus a pure Piano plus a pure Ogan clone or a pure Rompler, E keys will give you the best of all...

[Tasten-Bert]

Now I am at the point that I can only wish you good luck, IHaveQuestions, and I'm sure that when you listen to your gut feel you'll find the keyboards which inspire you most. That's always a major step on the road to play well. I would be glad if in some months time you could re-inform us about your ongoing and - hopefully - satisfaction.

[anotherscott]

That being said, while I do not WISH to lug around heavy equipment, if there are options that are SIGNIFICANTLY better, then I can overlook the weight... if that means going the way of two deep and complex boards over 40lbs, then so be it.

I'll probably go Montage as a bottom board, and perhaps a Jupiter 80 as a top. What that doesn't cover just won't get covered. lol.

It is impossible to know for certain whet your perfect combo would be... online research tells you a lot but you never know for sure until you get your own fingers and ears around it, and it sounds like you won't have a chance to try much with your time constraint. Still, I'm sure Montage + J80 will be a great sounding rig. But if you want a weighted hammer action for your bottom board, are you aware that the Montage 8 is 64 lbs? Maybe over 40 by more than you expected. That might be a reason to look at the MODX8... you lose some functionality/features, but you do get the same sounds.

[IHaveQuestions]

That being said, while I do not WISH to lug around heavy equipment, if there are options that are SIGNIFICANTLY better, then I can overlook the weight... if that means going the way of two deep and complex boards over 40lbs, then so be it.

I'll probably go Montage as a bottom board, and perhaps a Jupiter 80 as a top. What that doesn't cover just won't get covered. lol.

It is impossible to know for certain whet your perfect combo would be... online research tells you a lot but you never know for sure until you get your own fingers and ears around it, and it sounds like you won't have a chance to try much with your time constraint. Still, I'm sure Montage + J80 will be a great sounding rig. But if you want a weighted hammer action for your bottom board, are you aware that the Montage 8 is 64 lbs? Maybe over 40 by more than you expected. That might be a reason to look at the MODX8... you lose some functionality/features, but you do get the same sounds.

I was getting a Montage 7, for the record.

Same sounds with the MODX? Are you losing anything with how expressive the board will be? I'll imagine they cut some corners in that regard(ex. polyphony).

[Mr_-G-]

Montage has 128 polyphony in the AWM2 section and 128 FMX section.
MODX has 128 polyphony (AWM2 section) but "only" 64 in the FMX section.

So you get half the FM polyphony. Otherwise they have the same sound engines. You can import Montage sounds and libraries in the MODX.
There is some other limitation in the MIDI implementation (Midi channels hard wired to parts controlled by MIDI) and some less buttons on the panel. But the price difference is quite important. The above differences might not be that important for live playing. The weight difference is also noticeable. They keybed might be different, so you really should check this personally side by side.

[anotherscott]

[

I was getting a Montage 7, for the record.

Ah. Okay, just be sure you're okay playing piano from a non-hammer action. I haven't played that board, and it's supposed to have one of the better non-hammer actions, but it will still be less than ideal for piano control/expressivity.

Same sounds with the MODX? Are you losing anything with how expressive the board will be?

Well, if you got the MODX8, the weighted action may make it more expressive for piano. But you can lose expressivity elsewhere... for example, no aftertouch or ribbon controller.

I'll imagine they cut some corners in that regard(ex. polyphony).

As Mr G said, there is less polyphony for the FM engine. But in this situation, I don't think it matters at all. But there are other differences that may be more significant. I mentioned the ribbon and aftertouch. Some others are having 1.75 GB of user memory vs. 1 GB; a lot more front panel controls (buttons, sliders, knobs); LED indicators for the knobs and sliders; seamless sound transitions between sets of up to 8 sounds instead of 4; internal power supply instead of what some people find to be a nuisance wall wart; additional assignable outputs (lets you do things like individually route specific sounds to different outboard processing or amplification). In short, you trade off some control, flexibility, features in moving from the Montage to the MODX, and the actions are different... but the sounds are the same.

There is some other limitation in the MIDI implementation (Midi channels hard wired to parts controlled by MIDI)

Same limitation there on both the Montage and MODX, afaik.