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Re: The IEM Thing

Postby Quai34 » 18 Oct 2018, 07:34

CountFosco wrote:
Quai34 wrote:Hi Guys,
A bit of my update on the IEM Journey started a while ago by Cipholis.


PS I think you might have just turned Chuck into an STD. :D


Oups, Chuck, I'm sorry...Ok, you didn't take offense about this one...Well, my issue is that I've ben so many times with sound check guy that says there are super "Pro" and super "good" to realize that I know much more about sound check than them that i'm a bit worried to let them do what they want...On top of that, even the one that are fairly good have been mixing loud classic rock bands (hundreds here in Winnipeg) and are really something the kind of like "Keys are nice to see but don't need to be heard"...I had few times to STOP playing on a song when I was supposed to play at first, just because I turned down my keys in my monitors and was not hearing myself at all in the front PA...The main singer, after I told him that I won't play anymore if the sound guy is not doing what needs to be done for my kesy had to tell the sound guy that he has to turn up my keys...I saved half of set 2 and set 3 with this but set 1 and beginning of set 2 were horrible...
Ok, that was the extreme one but just to tell you...
Last edited by Quai34 on 18 Oct 2018, 07:39, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The IEM Thing


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Re: The IEM Thing

Postby Quai34 » 18 Oct 2018, 07:38

CountFosco wrote:Sounds like a lot of moving parts, and the risk that you're fighting your mixer. Once you're sound checked and EQ'd, he/she will just want to control keys up or down. Nothing more. It's your responsibility to match the levels of your various outputs, and most of that work should be done before you hit the stage. Just my 2 cents, but given that you have one (did you say two?) sound techs, I would say it's of zero importance for you to monitor the FOH mix, actually counterproductive.


This will be my second monitoring mixer, monitoring only, just to switch between various outputs? I might be needing to just monitor my keys via the headphone output of the main mixer like CPhollis (Yeah!!! he's not an STD anymore...) is doing and like what has been suggested by Dhpd Nord. The various volume outputs are balanced on the main Keys premix, two Tascam Lm-8ST that I usually don't touch but the issue is that, as I said in the previous email, they tend not to put my keys at all in the mix....
Well, I might tend to complicate things because I haven't found a sound guy I can trust yet...Might be really tough in my area tough....
Last edited by Quai34 on 18 Oct 2018, 07:43, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The IEM Thing

Postby Quai34 » 18 Oct 2018, 07:54

Berretje wrote:
CountFosco wrote:I would say it's of zero importance for you to monitor the FOH mix, actually counterproductive.


Same here (for both bands). We have a good (and always the same) sound guy who knows how to mix. I never have/want to hear the FOH mix.
I only have to worry about my own mix. Who is pretty steady because I'm now using the P16-M from behringer.

Gr
Bart

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Ok, you could use the Berhinger with an Analog board? I mean, how do I connect it to my Mackie Onyx? I know, if I would have had the cash, I would buy the Allen and Health QU16 that I know very well because my former rock band has it...But when I took the time to prepare scenes in order for the best sound guy we thought, he came to learn about the board for one hour, said he was ok, but at the very last minute, asked my guitarist who was the band leader to rent a classic mackie VLZ 16 channels because it was easier to work with...
Then, if I take the time to use all the functionality of a Digital mixer and ending with some guys who don't even want to use them, I'm still screwed...And I have to pay for the IEM for the rest of the band and so on...Guitarist is using my stuff, bassist is using my stuff, drummer is using my stuff, at least at my place because he doesn't want to carry his Yamaha Tour Custom from 1986 from his practice place in a community building to my place frorpractice and back and forth...So, he bought a 400 CAN$ little drum kit, complete with all Hardware and cymbals, basswood etc, that I doubt will sound good..So, I invested in a drum kit, used, but realy nice souding:
Tama Vintage Royalstar 1973 plus Avedis Zildjian 1970 Cymbals..: I know the guy, I even pay the kit in five instalments...
Link for different pictures of the drum kit by the way...
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fkbooi6zaoc1 ... Rqbja?dl=0

Peter's Tama Royalstar 2.JPG
Peter's Tama Royalstar 2.JPG (107.37 KiB) Viewed 2293 times

As I said, IEM are better than Wedge monitor but at 150CAN$ for a wireless transmitter and a headset, I can tell you, the quality is just so, so...Good enough for practice but I don't think I would rely on this for our first "Coming out gig" with the press, the TV and so on...
So, I'm trying to do it with what I already have...
Last edited by Quai34 on 18 Oct 2018, 08:08, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: The IEM Thing

Postby Quai34 » 18 Oct 2018, 09:27

Ok, I found how to connect the Mackie to the Pm, you use this, the P16-1 distributing sytem, fed by the direct output of the Onyx via 2 DB25 Direct Out to TRS balanced cables (Planet wave for example...):
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail ... put-module

Ok, you still have after that to buy 6 PM at 300$ each....
And only my two main singers that have an TC Helicon Voice Live II will hear their effects, the drummer and the two other singers won't hear the effects we put via Effect send because the Direct out of the Mackie is either after of before EQ and Insert but there is no option to give them, the reverb we put on the Snare for the Drummer and the one we put on the two back vocals...I have only 16 channels and they are all used by instruments and microphones...
Well, with the Mackie, with the Return 1 to Monitor 5 and return 2 To Monitor 6, I can feed a bit of reverb to the Guitarist and bassist (That are on Monitor send 5) and the Drummer (who is on Monitor send 6...).
And they don,t even know how to dial their sound in so, I don't see them working on their personal mixes on their own...
S--T, that's not easy, they are very good players, they let me do whatever I need to improve the sound, they love it but they are not tech savy guys...
Last edited by Quai34 on 18 Oct 2018, 09:40, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The IEM Thing

Postby CountFosco » 18 Oct 2018, 09:34

Quai34 wrote:
Oups, Chuck, I'm sorry...Ok, you didn't take offense about this one...Well, my issue is that I've ben so many times with sound check guy that says there are super "Pro" and super "good" to realize that I know much more about sound check than them that i'm a bit worried to let them do what they want...On top of that, even the one that are fairly good have been mixing loud classic rock bands (hundreds here in Winnipeg) and are really something the kind of like "Keys are nice to see but don't need to be heard"...I had few times to STOP playing on a song when I was supposed to play at first, just because I turned down my keys in my monitors and was not hearing myself at all in the front PA...The main singer, after I told him that I won't play anymore if the sound guy is not doing what needs to be done for my kesy had to tell the sound guy that he has to turn up my keys...I saved half of set 2 and set 3 with this but set 1 and beginning of set 2 were horrible...
Ok, that was the extreme one but just to tell you...


Well that's pretty sh*tty, but it sounds like a problem that could be solved by discussion rather than by throwing gear at it. You want to go to the gig, play the keys, maybe boogie around with your keytar, and just have fun. You don't want the stress of being a school teacher to the mixer. Maybe part of the problem is with the guitar levels. If most of the FOH guitar is coming directly from his amp, maybe the mixer doesn't have much control over him, and bumping up the keys just makes everything too loud.
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Re: The IEM Thing

Postby Quai34 » 18 Oct 2018, 10:04

Yes, you are absolutely right, the guitarist was using two 100W tube amp, front stage and the sound guy didn't want to fight against him and telling him that he has to use the amp just like a personal monitor, and even put them back side ways and not towards the public...
This is why I left this band anyway and my new guitarist, a blues/funk guy is always afraid to be two much loud, I even ask him sometime to turn him up a bit when guitar is so important t in songs like get lucky....
My issue is that there is not sound guys that I know of who still have the willingness or the love of doing great sound enough to take every new show like a new challenge....They just want to come for 3/4 hours, set their levels, take the 200/250$ and done....
And my new project, it's a new band, with "new" music for the area (no pure Funk/Dance bands around us, even the 2/3 big weddings bands that charge 5000$ are doing a bit of everything....and still a lot of rock....and their sound is quite crap...)
So, you're right, before trying to throw gear, I need to look for a guy that I can discuss with and explain what I need/want in order to trust him....
Thanks for the idea, which seems to be obvious but in this thread it was more IEM and personal monitor/more gear than sound guy....
I will keep my small pace with investing in good IEM for me for now, wired, a PM-55 personal headphone amp like suggested before and I will see....
I still have to make my members more responsible for their own sound as well and to take care of that....Even the guitarist count on me to dial in my pedalboard, he was just using Boss OD and Dunlop Wah, no chorus, no Flanger etc....
Ok, going to bed now, time to rest.
Thanks again
Sincerely
Last edited by Quai34 on 18 Oct 2018, 10:07, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The IEM Thing

Postby Berretje » 18 Oct 2018, 14:01

Quai34 wrote:
Ok, you could use the Berhinger with an Analog board? I mean, how do I connect it to my Mackie Onyx?


Ah wait, you missed some news about this. We kicked out the Allen & Heath monitoring mixer (analog) and went digital with a small rack that holds the Midas rackmixer.
The drummer and I have a P16-M and the rest is managing their mixes through the mobile app.

But yeah, if you have an analog mixer, you'll need the Behringer Powerplay P16-I to convert it to a digital (Ultranet) signal.
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Re: The IEM Thing

Postby Quai34 » 19 Oct 2018, 04:21

Berretje wrote:
Quai34 wrote:
Ok, you could use the Berhinger with an Analog board? I mean, how do I connect it to my Mackie Onyx?


Ah wait, you missed some news about this. We kicked out the Allen & Heath monitoring mixer (analog) and went digital with a small rack that holds the Midas rackmixer.
The drummer and I have a P16-M and the rest is managing their mixes through the mobile app.

But yeah, if you have an analog mixer, you'll need the Behringer Powerplay P16-I to convert it to a digital (Ultranet) signal.


Ha ok, yes, I had missed one big change on your gear....Great, I will have a look at the Midas mixer....But as said above, I' trying to be ready for the first gigs wi what I currently have.....Then, may be the A&H QU16, I liked it a lot with my other band...Well, I was the only one, the other guys were just "plug and play"...In a bad sense...
Thanks for the new infos.
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Re: The IEM Thing

Postby Quai34 » 19 Nov 2018, 18:32

Hi Guys,
Am i right to say that this thing is the equivalent of the Rolls PM55 or the Rolls PM351? I think so:
http://www.artproaudio.com/product/mymonitorii/

It's just that it's easier here in Canada to get the Art Pro Audio because Long and mac Quade is the distributor in Canada for this Brand...But the Stereo monitor input could be the input from my Tascam L/R output, my Tascam being my Premix for keys...And the instrument line input will be the Aux return form the Mackie Onyx for me, right? And I could even have a microphone plugged in that I could use for an ambient mic or a singing mic using the thru if I have to...Right?

If my assumption are right, well, I have found what I need...

let me know what do you think...

Sincerely
Last edited by Quai34 on 19 Nov 2018, 18:49, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The IEM Thing

Postby ajstan » 20 Nov 2018, 02:24

Quai34 wrote:Hi Guys,
Am i right to say that this thing is the equivalent of the Rolls PM55 or the Rolls PM351? I think so:
http://www.artproaudio.com/product/mymonitorii/

@Quai34 - it’s close. Here’s what it looks like vs. my PM55P (if I read the specs correctly):

- Doesn’t have a limiter.
- No ground lift capabilities.
- XLR input is mic level only. Won’t work with line level feed from main board. You can probably use an XLR to 1/4” adapter on the Line/Inst input as an alternative. If that works, then the extra Mic input is something the PM55P doesn’t have.
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