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Re: CPS Spacestation XL

Postby KyleM » 13 May 2017, 10:30

cphollis wrote:KyleM -- I own two of the current Spacestation V3. Not anything like you say. Go check out the 183-page thread over at Keyboard Corner, then come back and share your thoughts.

I am lucky enough to have a sizable inventory of self-powered PA units (2xQSC K8, 2xQSC K10, 2xQSC K12, 2xFA 12ac, 2xRCF TT08a). For small venues and rehearsals, the CPS SSv3 is quite unique in what it does. Not for everyone, but nothing else has the same secret sauce. Many loyal fans, including me.

The few people who have heard the XL have described it as just like the SSv3, only bigger and louder. And there's going to be a market for that. Yes, it will have to compete more intensely with a pair of self-powered PAs, but it will have an advantage in being able to surround the audience in a unique way.

I may buy one out of sheer curiosity.


Btw, thanks for the reply and I'm chiseling through the 183 page post on Keyboard Corner. Yowsers! It sounds like they do something nothing else really can do, so they can charge a premium: I can't afford one of them lol. Let alone 2. I'll probably end up going with used QSC. K10 or K12 partially dependent on what you say, and I will most likely get them used. I could see myself adding a Spacestation down the line to try it out, once I start making money.
One of my goals on a new project I'm undertaking is have a bass player and me on keys and maybe a drummer to play instrumental music and I want to focus on stereo music in smaller clubs with cool lighting and special effects. Eat candy/ eye candy stuff...
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Re: CPS Spacestation XL


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Re: CPS Spacestation XL

Postby cphollis » 13 May 2017, 12:51

I too had a negative experience with the Motion Sound KBR 3D or whatever it was called. Mine's for sale if anyone wants it. Awkward to lug, sucked at APs, and the leslie sound didn't scale to band volumes.

It's hard to answer what's better, more about what tool is right for the job. I play a lot of small venues. Hauling in a pair of K series, putting them on poles, and placing them in the optimum position just ain't happening. Larger stages and rooms, sure. Again, different tools for different situations.

The best way to place an SSv3 is using a small amp stand, sideways, side-firing speaker facing down. No harsh sounds beaming out the side. Full, rich stereo everywhere.

You asked about B3 organ sounds? Do you play with a stereo leslie sim? KILLER. Crank up the width control, and the whole room swirls with leslie. Lots of organ players would say the same thing, unless they're hauling around a real Leslie.

DPs, synths, etc. sound great. APs take a bit of work. Bass is good down to about 80-100 Hz, which is more than enough unless I'm using bass pedals or doing bass lines on synth. Bring a small sub if that's the case.

The challenge with a pair of self-powered PA units is that you have to aim them somewhere. And if you're not in the sweet spot, too bad for you. Not the case with the SSv3. And it can get very loud. Used ones are going for around $650 these days. Check out the garage sale section on the Keyboard Corner forum, they show up from time to time.

More here: http://chucksblog.typepad.com/late_bloo ... on-v3.html

The cheap-yet-adequate solution to stereo would be a pair of ElectroVoice ZXA1-90 units. People say they do the job. And you can get them for a lot less than the $499 list if you call around. Some folks like the Altos, I have no opinion either way.
Last edited by cphollis on 13 May 2017, 13:02, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: CPS Spacestation XL

Postby KyleM » 13 May 2017, 16:45

Awesome thanks for the input. I am somewhat swayed toward the space station now. I definitely couldn't afford two, but a used/new one might be feasible (if I can finance it.) I would love to hear them in person... I have a Nord Stage 2 and that's the only organ. I listened to a binaural recording of the Spacestation in some headphones and it was pretty convincing. I would almost have to had a sub so I will probably be relegated to a pair of cheap pa speakers (if not only 1) and after I start said some money jump into the Spacestation. You definitely chsnged my mind as far as considering them...thanks a lot
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Re: CPS Spacestation XL

Postby cphollis » 13 May 2017, 21:36

One SSv3 is all you need. The Nord organs sound amazing to me, hard to imagine better without hauling a real Leslie, and even then :) You're going to get reasonable bass, not solid bass. I get the $$$ situation, but cheap PA speakers sound, well, cheap. Very annoying to my ears.

What got expensive for me was buying and selling gear that didn't work out. Save up and get something that does the job?
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Re: CPS Spacestation XL

Postby pablomastodon » 06 Jun 2017, 07:04

totally agreed...spending $$ on stuff which doesn't make your ears smile is wasted money and then you take a beating when selling it

If you have to, buy something cheap and work it as hard and as fast as you can to save up for the decent replacement, and then never look back. No one will much care how good your playing skills are if the sound is not pleasing. In many/most cases, general audiences may not be so discriminating. I always put the most stock into pleasing the venue owners, managers and staff. They have the benefit of hearing lots of different people come through. And be assured that they will notice if you have high quality sound. Especially if the band who played there the night before was running sound by Samson or similar. Poor sound quality will, consciously or subconsciously, fatigue an audience's ears. And when so much of the competition is running poor quality sound, having high quality sound will elevate you, make you stand out from that crowd. Ears which are thirsty for clean, pretty sound will happily soak up all they can get. :-)

unless, of course, you're playing headbanger music....

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Re: CPS Spacestation XL

Postby cphollis » 11 Jun 2017, 18:33

pablomastodon wrote:totally agreed...spending $$ on stuff which doesn't make your ears smile is wasted money and then you take a beating when selling it

If you have to, buy something cheap and work it as hard and as fast as you can to save up for the decent replacement, and then never look back. No one will much care how good your playing skills are if the sound is not pleasing. In many/most cases, general audiences may not be so discriminating. I always put the most stock into pleasing the venue owners, managers and staff. They have the benefit of hearing lots of different people come through. And be assured that they will notice if you have high quality sound. Especially if the band who played there the night before was running sound by Samson or similar. Poor sound quality will, consciously or subconsciously, fatigue an audience's ears. And when so much of the competition is running poor quality sound, having high quality sound will elevate you, make you stand out from that crowd. Ears which are thirsty for clean, pretty sound will happily soak up all they can get. :-)

unless, of course, you're playing headbanger music....

bless, pablo


Truth spoken here. Pablo's right: it's the venue staff you have to please. And quality sound (and moderate sound levels) will help with this discriminating group.
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Re: CPS Spacestation XL

Postby normalkeyboa » 14 Jul 2018, 21:11

I got the XL and used it at two outside gigs as main PA (my keys, 3 female vocalists one of which plays acoustic guitar w pickup through the XL). Bass and electric guitar went through own amps. No stage monitors except Roland CM-30 near drummer. Positioned XL sort of stage right, pointing angled mostly at audience but a little toward band. Happened to also use 2 of Aspen Pittman's condenser mics and one dynamic mic. I panned singers left, center, and right and stuck my keys a little left and acoustic guitar a little right hoping to take advantage of the XL's stereo projection. Observations so far:

1. Stereo image is subtle but present. Probably need a lot more experimentation to get it right. Not sure how it works outside with no walls or floor to reflect off of like it would indoors.

2. What I was not expecting but was pleasantly surprised by was the clarity & distinctness, more than the Bose L1-2 we've used in past and the Mackie 450s in our rehearsal space. Our singers and a couple audience members mentioned they liked the sound. I don't know what extent this was due to the mics or the XL but keyboard and acoustic guitar also sounded more clear. I also realized that improved clarity is double edge sword- our mistakes were also more clear. There is no hiding or forgiveness with this setup, if vocal harmonies are off a little or you mistakenly softly hit adjacent key you hear it loud and clear.

3. At 65 pounds, it's heavy, I use hand truck and bandmates help if steps are involved. The handles have worked well so far. They are on side, not on top, as once pictured on CPS site.

4. I was able to get enough volume for crowd and stage without feedback but couldn't go much louder without feedback. I think experimentation with position could improve this.

I also used as keyboard amp in heavily carpeted kind of formal banquet room for private party. I was stuck in corner and probably too close to it to hear much of the stereo effect but it did sound good and band-mates again remarked on clarity of sound.

I knew I wanted something other than standard keyboard amp and that could be both keyboard amp and main PA speaker. For awhile was looking at portable line arrays but I found the concept of stereo everywhere from one box compelling so took a shot at the XL. So far I'm glad I did.

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Re: CPS Spacestation XL

Postby Bjosko » 17 Jul 2018, 12:39

I am not sure you will do any good with panning on the CPS ? I think it are the summing of left and right that are making the magic, so if the two input channels are uneven, the stereo effect will die, and the sound will only be present through the front speaker.
But since the XL’s front speaker and effect have been upgraded, you hopefully will get a much better sound, even with mono sources.
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Re: CPS Spacestation XL

Postby Ledbetter » 19 Jul 2018, 02:05

It isn’t stereo. If you pan a channel all the way right (or left) it will come out of both sides of the side-firing speaker, phase positive on one side and phase negative on the other.
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Re: CPS Spacestation XL

Postby normalkeyboa » 21 Jul 2018, 17:33

Interesting, panning has effect but I think you are right it is not locating the source in the stereo field as I had hoped. When I play a Rhodes sound (using Korg Module triggered by Stage EX) and with tremolo turned on and in stereo it is definitely much different then mono but not bouncing left and right like it does in headphones. It is kind of "wider". Similar for Nord organs with rotary. I have to experiment more as my home rehearsal space is smallish room so I'm only like 3' from the Spacestation. It does sound good though.

I have gig in September at venue with decent house PA & sound person, and enough time for proper sound check, will be interesting to see how they handle the XL. Last time we played there I went through the house PA. Keyboard player in band we opened for (blues) told me he won't go through house PA anywhere anymore (he's like 70 yrs old, playing for decades), he brings his own powered PA speaker. Won't go through stage monitors either. He told me he doesn't want anyone else controlling his sound.
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