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Sample Editor Update - Why Not ?

Postby cellomangler » 25 Jul 2012, 00:59

Even if we don't get another OS update for the current Wave, we certainly should get an update to the Sample Editor. Please PLEASE create an import function so that samples from other libraries or personal collections and their "already established" loop points can be loaded. Even a Sound Designer format import option (that retains the loop settings) would be nice. I don't see why, since the Nord Sample collections are given to users free anyhow, why this functionality isn't implemented. (Other than, of course, a programmer must spend the time to do it and be paid for that time :roll: )
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Sample Editor Update - Why Not ?


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Re: Sample Editor Update - Why Not ?

Postby mjbrands » 25 Jul 2012, 01:38

That would of course be helpful for any Nord that can use samples, not just the Wave. I agree it would be a very welcome feature.
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Re: Sample Editor Update - Why Not ?

Postby bdodds » 25 Jul 2012, 16:07

Yeah, I consider all of the software utilities and raw sample data that we get from Nord as a bonus, and tend to not look a gift horse in the mouth. It shouldn't stop us from suggesting improvements, but certainly needs to be done diplomatically. I don't think we should feel entitled to something that is not exactly promoted as a selling point. Just my opinion, of course.
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Re: Sample Editor Update - Why Not ?

Postby mjbrands » 25 Jul 2012, 17:56

I see it as an integral part of products like the Wave and Stage 2, as Clavia specifically mentions "... thanks to the included Nord Sample Editor for Mac and PC, allows user-created samples to be loaded into the instrument and thus opening up a whole new creative world of sound." (from the product page of the Stage 2).

If they didn't want people to start nagging them about new features, I think they should've enabled people to use some third party product. For example, if the Nord Sound Manager were able to read Sound Font or maybe EXS files, they might not have had to develop and provide the Sample Manager. They could still convert the files to their own (lossless) compression format.

Of course I'm over-simplifying stuff here. But I am convinced that if Clavia were to implement every feature they've been asked for up to now, the list of new features people would want them to implemented soon (tm) would be even longer.

I must say I was pleased they added functionality to the Stage 2 to generate better lists of programs (i.e. what program uses what sample), though assuming it had something to do with the fact I did something like that for the Wave would be going a bit far I suppose. :crazy:

I do agree with your 'diplomacy' comment.
Last edited by mjbrands on 31 Jul 2012, 12:33, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Sample Editor Update - Why Not ?

Postby cellomangler » 25 Jul 2012, 22:03

I'm suggesting a logical progression and useful extension of a product. I don't understand what you mean by "diplomacy" ? What's Clavia going to do, take my Wave away from me if I ask about an open sample format ? I paid money for my keyboard, it wasn't a gift from Clavia. And it's a great -no, fantastic- musical tool. But they WANT to hear what people want... because that's how marketing works.
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Re: Sample Editor Update - Why Not ?

Postby Frantz » 26 Jul 2012, 10:35

I tend to think that too many features can kill a product.
Sample Editor Update - Why Not ? Why no conversion ? Because it has not been in the scope for development at Clavia. The "diplomacy" thing means to me that we cannot replace Clavia's view on what to do or not, but, as bdodds said "It shouldn't stop us from suggesting improvements", of course.

An import function, why not, good idea that would simplify the process of making NSMP instruments.
For instance, I would like to have the loops imported, but, tell me if I 'm wrong, I think there is no standard format for that, wav file format can't include loop points, and aiff is apple's. Sample conversion is a converter affair, not really for clavia, we are using external programs for that.
Ableton's sampler has converted me some exs and akai instruments for instance ... just drag 'n drop the file on Ableton's sampler instrument. If clavia was doing a sampler ... we would have some velocity layers first ? maybe they are working on it, I dunno !
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Re: Sample Editor Update - Why Not ?

Postby cellomangler » 27 Jul 2012, 01:19

The Sound Designer format, which is still supported by Sound Forge and most sample editors, retains the sample point loop information. Even the sound font SF2 specification would work nicely as there are a quite a few conversion apps for it. I don't know if Clavia has, or is willing, to make their sample format specifications open for third party developers, such as Chicken Systems, for example. The EXS24 format is very popular and supported by many editors. Clavia may not want their proprietary samples to be used in other samplers -but of course that would not be a problem if just the import feature was implemented by the Sample Editor. That would keep the existing sample libraries proprietary and just open up the library and the sonic potential of the Wave. Might help to sell off the inventory, if that's what they are planning to do anyway....

BTW... here is possibly a much simpler addition to the Sample Editor program. Right now, the display/data entry for Loop Start and Length is in milliseconds. If there was an option to display that information in "sample units". Then, even though a bit tedious, those numbers could be entered for a given wave file that has been edited or opened in another editor that displays the loop point and length in "sample units", such as Sound Forge.
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Re: Sample Editor Update - Why Not ?

Postby Frantz » 30 Jul 2012, 12:44

cellomangler wrote:BTW... here is possibly a much simpler addition to the Sample Editor program. Right now, the display/data entry for Loop Start and Length is in milliseconds. If there was an option to display that information in "sample units". Then, even though a bit tedious, those numbers could be entered for a given wave file that has been edited or opened in another editor that displays the loop point and length in "sample units", such as Sound Forge.


+1

I had to enter the loop points manually into Nord Sample Editor too. My problem was solved by Ableton Sampler (again). It took my original exs24 instrument and can display the loop point in both units ("sample units" or "ms").
I thought this was a lucky situation and I would prefer to have this facility into Nord Sample Editor too.
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Re: Sample Editor Update - Why Not ?

Postby cellomangler » 01 Aug 2012, 21:32

frantzkb wrote:I had to enter the loop points manually into Nord Sample Editor too. My problem was solved by Ableton Sampler (again). It took my original exs24 instrument and can display the loop point in both units ("sample units" or "ms"). I thought this was a lucky situation and I would prefer to have this facility into Nord Sample Editor too.

Did you find that using milliseconds was accurate enough, ie, were you able to hit the exact loop point to avoid any glitches ? I just figured that using sample units was the only way to copy the loop point since the sample unit is the "true" smallest unit of division of the audio file.
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