Nord User Forum

So the same friend who has been letting me borrow his 3124 mb+ lent me his Radial Pro D2 DI again today. It made all the difference in smoothing out the sound going into this BAE DLB API 312 that was mentioned earlier.
http://baeaudio.com/index.php?option=co ... Itemid=197

In fact I A/B'd the 3124 and BAE and I can honestly say the BAE smoked it-even with the non-Jensen based Radial DI. Fuller, more hi-fi, clearer and just a more robust sound with the NP. From what I've been told by BAE, this is due to different op-amps used in the DLB designed by Avedis audio. Avedis is not far from me and I've had the pleasure of meeting him once, he really knows his stuff.
http://www.avedisaudio.com/about.html

This would be a lower low cost alternative for just one keyboard in stereo then the 3124. Street on the BAE is $1600 plus a Radial Duplex can be had for around $300. So for under 2K you would have world class sound. Of course you wouldn't have the 4 channels plus mixer flexibility and option to have one/ two vocal mics or extra keyboard.

But just talking straight sound and not functionality, the BAE is noticeably superior.

Sounds good. I myself need a rackmount mixer with at least 5 - 6 stereo pairs of inputs, which unfortunately puts a different complexion on things. I'm close to buying a Radial stereo passive DI box so I know I'm giving the FOH the best signal I can afford, but I wonder whether the "budget" mixer I'm currently using would compromise things too much.

Like I mentioned earlier in the thread, I found when I put the Radial Pro D2 in front of my A&H mixer, there was little noticeable difference in the sound coming out of my speakers. If I took the mixer out of the chain altogether and went straight from the DI to the XLR input on my RCFs, I did notice a slight smoother sound and tighter low end but nothing night and day.

However I'd think if you are sending FOH the signal from the Radial (especially the JDI or JDI Duplex with the Jensen transformer), BEFORE your mixer , your sound would be optimum.

Personally I'm probably going to spring for the Duplex. When I get it I'll run tests straight from the DI to my speakers and report if there's a major difference between that and the non-Jensen Pro D2.

You mentioned needing multiple stereo inputs. Radial makes one of these:
http://www.radialeng.com/r2011/jd6.php
It's not a mixer obviously but your sound to FOH would be first class. Your own sound, if you used a typical Mackie or A&H to monitor, wouldn't be as flattering obviously.

I decided to try a preamp (or in this case, a pair of mono preamps) that had known coloration. The result amazed me ! I used tube preamps and drove them hard to ensure that the tubes were driven into their nonlinear region. The Nord, for the first time, really sounded like a piano.
Here's the good part. The A.R.T. tube preamps cost $ 29 each - with free shipping from Music123.

Dave Ferris wrote:However I'd think if you are sending FOH the signal from the Radial (especially the JDI or JDI Duplex with the Jensen transformer), BEFORE your mixer , your sound would be optimum.

Personally I'm probably going to spring for the Duplex. When I get it I'll run tests straight from the DI to my speakers and report if there's a major difference between that and the non-Jensen Pro D2.

You mentioned needing multiple stereo inputs. Radial makes one of these:
http://www.radialeng.com/r2011/jd6.php
It's not a mixer obviously but your sound to FOH would be first class. Your own sound, if you used a typical Mackie or A&H to monitor, wouldn't be as flattering obviously.

Oops sorry, missed your reply.

That's interesting, I hadn't considered DI'ing before the mixer at all. Food for thought. I could see people liking that idea a lot. However I personally run my boards as a pre-mixed MIDI rig where everything is cross-patched to everything else - lots of layering etc. I think my best compromise is to try a Duplex on the mixer output. I can have all the flights of fancy I like, but the reality of sharing a stage with Marshall stacks probably makes fussing over details I may never hear somewhat moot at the end of the day. Hmmm...perhaps this jazz lark has got something going for it.

If you do end up springing for a Duplex or similar, I would love to hear your impressions of it.

jazzonebyone wrote:I decided to try a preamp (or in this case, a pair of mono preamps) that had known coloration. The result amazed me ! I used tube preamps and drove them hard to ensure that the tubes were driven into their nonlinear region. The Nord, for the first time, really sounded like a piano.
Here's the good part. The A.R.T. tube preamps cost $ 29 each - with free shipping from Music123.

I don't know man, $60 is too much.... Seriously, I do believe that it could improve the sound. I'd question how much noise it adds to the overall signal chain in addition to sacrificing some detail and hi fi quality. But hey, who says you need spend the big $$$$s to get something that works for you. Do they have DIs on the pre or are you using a DI box? I'd be curious in hearing it myself. Thanks for the post.

Red Leo -still waiting here on the arrival of the Radial Duplex. I ordered on 3/27 , the guy told me 3 days and it still isn't here.

I'm waiting here for the LA Vintage King guy to get a hold of the mother of all tube pres for me to check out-the DW Fearn VT2. It's actually more for recording my Steinway-I don't think I'd wanna take a piece like that out for gigs.
But I would be curious to hear what it does for the Nord with the Duplex. He's also has the Pendulum MDP-1, which does have the DI. The Pendulum , from all I've read, is cleaner then the Fearn.

In any case they are probably 2 of the top rated tube pres available, so anxious to hear what they do for my DPA 4011 mics on the Steinway, as well as how they might differ from the API stuff I was using on the Nord.

So I purchased the Radial JDI Duplex locally here at W. LA Music on Sat. and used it that night on the NP.

Wow -big noticeable difference over the Pro D2. I was getting spoiled using all these high end preamps but just inserting the Duplex in the chain:

NP> Radial > A&H ZED 10- the sound was much smoother, less harsh then going instrument > A&H.

Nord Bosendorfer XL sounded way clearer and less boxy. XL Bright Grand was less bright and grating while still retaining that very forward, present sound. The Sparkletop rhodes, which can sometimes cut your head off with certain notes in the high register, was all round more even and punchy sounding. The stereo field was noticeably wider and more hi-fi. When I went to mono mode on the Nord, the sound wasn't as compressed.

The Duplex really tames the sometimes jumpy sounding high notes of the CP5.

This thing's wonderful !

The weird thing is-with the Duplex, both DPs sound better running into the inferior $375 A&H (somewhat colored) ZED mixer then my 2K Audio Upgrades/Jim Williams hot rodded , pristine quality Soundcraft Delta console-live through speakers that is, not recorded of course..

I'm sold

That's a pretty impressive report. I've heard good things about this DI box before, but to have it reliably quantified to such an extent is quite eye-opening. Definitely time to pony up some money. Thanks again for your time and effort in giving us all this information.

I was able to take out a DW Fearn VT2 today for demo. The Fearn VT2 is considered by many to be the mother of all tube preamps. I'm very excited to try this tomorrow with my mics on my Steinway.

But in the the meantime I hooked it up to the both the NP & CP5 via the Radial Duplex. Could be my ears today but I don't think I dig it on the Nord as much as the API 3124 & BAE DLB. It's hard when you're not recording something and you don't have the "other one' to A/B with. You're just kinda going on aural memory. The Fearn sounds real big in the low end, that's what it's known for, but I'm not hearing that same transparency and airy open sound (at least I don't think I am) that I was getting with the APi and to an even greater extent with the BAE. The CP5 seemed to fare better where the Nord's harshness seemed to rear it's ugly head a bit more. Strange.

In any case, just so I'm not hearing things, I'm going to see if I can take the BAE out again for an afternoon to run a quick A/B. Unfortunately for me, my friend sold his API 3124 mb+. I'm glad he sold it though in these tough economic times. He's using the dough to help fund a new vocal booth in his home studio.

I'll report back if I can compare the BAE & Fearn.