Nord User Forum

[Imran Khan]

The Dilemma
The quest for getting an acoustic original piano sound from Nord Piano 2 has consumed many hours of research and thousands of dollars in the form of investment in speakers over the last 4 months. The Nord Piano 2 was chosen after a thorough evaluation of available options, the criteria was simple; I wanted the most original feel of keys and the most accurate reproduction of acoustic piano sound from an electronic piano.
A friend who is a music producer suggested that it was best to buy monitors for listening to Nord as they produce the flattest sound without adding color to the sound, so we ordered for a pair of Yamahas HS 5 monitors. The Nord arrived, the monitors were bought and setup through Focusrite's Scarlett audio interface. As soon as the first key was struck, disappointment started to set in. The sound seemed too harsh and there was a complete lack of soundstage (I did not know what a soundstage was at that point of time). The monitors were adjusted to be placed at ear height level (Anyone who googles monitor speaker setup will find that monitors sound best at ear height level, with 2 monitors placed at a distance from each other while facing inward towards the listeners ears)
Over the past few month I heard the Nord on various speaker/monitor setups including Genelec 8030Bs monitors, KEF floor standing monitors, Sony home theater , Bose , JBL`s huge SP1 PA speakers, Technics vintage speakers, all speakers placement positions were tried room acoustic treatments were researched.
An acoustic piano has a frequency range of 27Hz to 4.2KHz, the various monitors we tried had a frequency range around 54Hz - 30kHz so we started doing research on speakers and monitors which could give the 27 to 40 hz range response required when playing the lowest octave . It was apparent that a subwoofer was needed to cater for the lowest octaves. However a good pair of monitors coupled with a sub-woofer (to cover the whole frequency range of an acoustic piano) was costing around 4000-5000$ (the monitors considered were mid field monitors so that they could be placed at ear level height 6-8 feet away at from the piano in order to get the big sound feel of an acoustic piano)
I was so disappointed that I thought would it not be better to get an upright acoustic piano instead? (The room is not big enough for a baby grand piano). But getting an acoustic piano has its own limitations: you can’t decrease the volume so that you don’t disturb the neighbors in case you want to practice late night, you can’t shift to a Bosendorfer or Steinway piano with the touch of button, cant record your own playing session without a good recording setup etc. I wanted to stay with my NORD and yet somehow be able to get the most accurate sound and feel of an acoustic piano without spending too much money.
The Solution
Before I spend another couple of thousand dollars on an acoustic upright piano or monitors/speakers, we thought of trying an out of the box idea by placing the monitors below the Nord Piano. Lo and behold the sound was instantly bigger and better, the 5 inch monitors are sounding better than floor standing speakers, it was pleasantly shocking and amazing! I have researched loads of forums, speaker/monitor manuals, speaker placement suggestions and NO One has ever said about trying to place speakers below the piano, Yes it adds some base to the sound but it also adds body, something missing from monitors when placed at ear level, the Nord has finally started to sound like an acoustic piano. My final setup will be to get rid of Yamahas HS5 and get Yamahas HS8 instead with a subwoofer, the total price will be less than 1000$. Thank God for giving the inspiration to go against the norms and try something new. Hope this helps anyone who is facing the same situation as I did.

[AlQuinn]

Very interesting. I've been on the same quest for quite a while. I understand you placed the speakers below the Nord, but can you tell me if they were on the floor or elevated, and if they were angled up or shooting parallel to the floor (a photo would be ideal). Thanks!

[Imran Khan]

Simply on floor with carpet parallel to floor. Hope to post a photo tomorrow

[orcoaffamato]

Haven't you tried a pair of Genelec M030 or M040?
I use a pair of M030 for my C2D in my room (I will add to them this summer the Genelec 7060b subwoofer and a pair of M040).

[costaseglezos]

I use the yamaha hs-50 placed on the ear-height and paired with the yamaha hs-10 subwoofer below the electro 3.
I am absolutely happy with the sound and it costed about 800 euros. Also, I have to mention that I can't use the XL samples in the E3. I liked the yamaha sound so much, that I even got the yamaha stagepas 400i for playing live and it turned to be quite "close" to the sound in my studio.

[cphollis]

It seems you're using your Nord Piano 2 for home use, which brings up all these amplification issues. While I am a huge fan of Nords for performing, I've found a better answer for digital home pianos: the Yamaha AvantGrand series. I have a N3 which I absolutely love as much as an acoustic grand. The upright versions are pretty stellar as well.

The amplification is integrated with the product design, making it good enough to fool you into thinking you're playing a far more expensive acoustic piano. And it never needs tuning

[RedLeo]

The reason nobody has suggested putting speakers on the floor under the piano is because it's a really bad idea. All you are doing is losing huge amounts of treble and upper mids while almost certainly artificially boosting the bass and lower mids. In short, the sound you are hearing is nothing like the instrument actually sounds. If you prefer it like that, then fine, but I think you will be pretty much in a minority of one.

You may be happy with the sound you're getting for a while, but I think in time you will come to realise that the problem is not with monitor speakers in general, but with your own perception of what good sound is. Certainly, the muffled bassy sound you're getting now is not what any piano actually sounds like and I can't imagine that it will satisfy you for very long.

[Imran Khan]

I am using monitors in my living room, not an acoustically treated studio. in an untreated room, when monitors are placed at ear height, they loose the sound stage, while ear level height is good for sound imaging for hearing a mix of various instruments, by my experience it is not good for reproduction of the sound of an acoustic piano . However the issue is not to hear a good mix, my issue was to get the feel of bigger sound you get from an acoustic piano. I did go and play the acoustic piano a couple of times, took a few friends with me so that I was not relying on my own perception only. People who use monitors hardly ever use it as speakers for an electric piano, their objective is different i.e creating a good mix that will sound good on a variety of home audio systems , car speakers and headphones. My article was not to start a debate on the correct height of monitors, it was just about what placement is best for listening experience closest to an acoustic piano.

I have replaced the Yamaha HS5 and gotten a pair of HS8, although they need to be driven to get the best out of them but so far I am pleased with the sound.

[orcoaffamato]

My room isn't acoustically treated too. I suggest you to check a pair of Genelec M040 ('cause you want a bigger sound) maybe with a sub. Genelec M series has the room response control feature.

They are more expensive then the Yamahas: one of them costs as two HS8.
You can check here:http://www.genelec.com/music-creation/home/step1/