We are using cookies to give you the best experience on our site. Cookies are files stored in your browser and are used by most websites to help personalise your web experience. If you "ACCEPT" setting, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Accept
Everything about the Nord Piano, Nord Piano 2, and the new Nord Piano 3.

Re: Amber Upright

Postby Gambold » 12 Jul 2017, 15:17

>Creating the sample made Nord zero money. <

This suggests they make new samples for free (indeed, at a loss, since it costs money to make them). I disagree...new samples MAKE Nord money because ongoing new samples sell their product line - and are part of the business plan to do so. They would hardly spend the money and time to make them if it wasn't finally good for their bottom line.

When you buy a Nord you also buy a future of new samples coming down the line. The beef is that they are getting too big for older keyboards to use.
Last edited by Gambold on 12 Jul 2017, 15:21, edited 2 times in total.
Gambold
 

Re: Amber Upright


Sponsor
 

Re: Amber Upright

Postby harmonizer » 12 Jul 2017, 16:29

I'll just share that as an Electro 3 owner, I feel fortunate to be able to use any of these latest samples. I have not figured out the Amber Upright yet, but the Nefertiti EP and Royal Grand sounds were really excellent additions which were made available over 3 years after I bought my Electro 3.
User avatar
harmonizer
 
Posts: 227
Joined: 25 Dec 2012, 17:10
Location: NJ, USA
Country: United States of America
Has thanked: 26 times
Been thanked: 57 times
Your Nord Gear #1: Nord Electro 3

Re: Amber Upright

Postby Rusty Mike » 12 Jul 2017, 17:01

Gambold wrote:The beef is that they are getting too big for older keyboards to use.


Part of this is simply the progression of technology. When Nord introduced v5 of the Piano Library, it excluded Electro 2 owners from the new sounds. the E2 simply didn't have the memory or proper OS structure to support the new sample library. It was already a discontinued product, but you still see a fair number of them still being used today. Naturally the E2 owners were not happy about being excluded, but there still seems to be a decent market for the E2. A lot of people think it produced the best Clavinet sound out of the all Electro's.

The technology march in cars is a very similar thing. It used to be that backup cameras were only in the high end vehicles, and now pretty much every new car has them (I believe by law in the US now). We don't complain that our older car can't be retrofitted for free by the manufacturers. We also understand that an older car simply cannot be upgraded to support an iPhone or Android if it didn't have the capability already. We simple accept that we would have to trade in our old car and get a new one if we want that feature. This applies to a bunch of stuff these days: televisions, computers, smart phones, kitchen appliances, washing machines, etc. The choice is ultimately ours as to whether and how we live with the stuff we already own or trade up. The vehicle manufacturer owes us nothing outside of warranty obligations, and we don't expect it.

I recall when the Grand Imperial sample came out. It was the first to include an XL size, and it's HUGE! Even the smaller sizes were a bump up from the prior pianos. It certainly started getting me thinking about how I was going to arrange the piano samples in the meager 185MB of piano memory in my Electro 3. To some extent, it was a relief to me that I wasn't all that crazy about the sound of the Grand Imperial.

I managed to work it all out. In the end I kept a brighter grand (Silver), a mellower grand (Lady D), an upright (Queen) and a few EPs. I happily played the Electro this way for years until I recently sold it. Even now with the Stage 2EX, I carefully select what kinds and sizes of pianos I keep in memory. The decisions are largely based on if and how I can use them. I don't have a need for a huge variety of pianos, and have a few go-to sounds. So the mix is partly "must haves" and partly "experiments". I still mostly use the Silver Grand and Lady D. I like those samples and they fit well for what I do. The rest of my band mates don't even notice.

Gambold, you are correct that the expanding piano and sample libraries are part of why we buy the products; there is an unwritten pact that they will continue to provide content to their customers. I don't know the technology behind their products, but I'm sure the people at Clavia are providing the most they can for us, and there's a reason why you cannot simply add a flash drive to expand the sample memory. They don't seem like people who would look to cheat their customers. You are also correct in that there is an upward trend in the amount of required memory with nearly every new piano sample release. I'm a bit simple about it though. I first determine if it's a sample that I can use, and will it make a significant difference in what I'm doing. If so, I will find a way to make it fit. If not, I happily play what I have.

One final thought - I don't think it's common for Yamaha, Roland or Korg provide continual free content and OS upgrades to their products. I know there are occasional OS fixes and upgrades, but it's not the norm. And, content is usually paid content. There may be some exceptions, but I'm not a customer of these companies, so someone else will need to correct me.
Mike from Central NJ, USA
Tools: Ten fingers, two feet, middle-age brain, questionable judgement and taste
Nords: Stage 2EX 76 HP, Electro 4D
User avatar
Rusty Mike
 
Posts: 358
Joined: 08 Nov 2011, 21:57
Location: United States
Country: United States of America
Has thanked: 20 times
Been thanked: 154 times
Your Nord Gear #1: Nord Stage 2 EX
Your Nord Gear #2: Nord Electro 4

Re: Amber Upright

Postby criss » 12 Jul 2017, 17:57

Wondering if the new Amber will be a keeper for you, Mike? A Queen upright killer?
I just tested it (the L version), it's nice but I'm not very impressed yet.
criss
 
Posts: 103
Joined: 08 Aug 2015, 15:07
Has thanked: 64 times
Been thanked: 23 times
Your Nord Gear #1: Nord Electro 5
Your Nord Gear #2: Nord Lead A1

Re: Amber Upright

Postby Gambold » 12 Jul 2017, 18:33

<Part of this is simply the progression of technology.<

Oh, I'm not outraged about it. I'll live. But it would be nice to get some kind of explanation from Clavia on why this is. There have been some good educated guesses on this forum, but the Clavia site itself is using the same copy it used for samples they were offering ten years ago. Given that Nord keyboards tend to have a long life and are passionately kept by their owners, there's a big pool of us who are getting left behind in this March of Progress.

It would just be nice to know why the Amber's L sample is 51% larger than the Queen's L - that's not an insignificant amount and I don't think it would reveal State Secrets to let these same passionate users know what's changed in the sampling process that requires so much more memory.

>One final thought - I don't think it's common for Yamaha, Roland or Korg provide continual free content and OS upgrades to their products<

No it isn't, but their product lines all tend to be cheaper than Clavia's. It's not easy to go apples to apples, but the 88-key Korg Kronos is selling for $800 less than the Stage 3.The Yamaha Montage 88 is $500 less. The higher price of Nord includes the ongoing sample library (in my opinion - others feel these are gifts that should be accepted with fulsome praise to Clavia.)
Last edited by Gambold on 12 Jul 2017, 18:36, edited 2 times in total.
Gambold
 

Re: Amber Upright

Postby Gambold » 12 Jul 2017, 18:48

>Wondering if the new Amber will be a keeper for you, Mike? A Queen upright killer?<

I tend to be a tech snob and just assume that the newer, larger samples will be better. I'm not a Nord sample aficionado and confess it's not easy for me to always hear striking differences between all the samples. I do insist on playing L sizes since a lot of my playing is solo or alone, and I can hear the difference when resonance and full pedal-down sampling is added. Since I already have those loaded, there's not a lot of reason for me to add a S for group playing.

With the Electro 4 I've settled on 2 Grands (Bright and Lady D), the CP80, and 1 Upright (Amber or Grand, can't decide yet) and then a very limited selection of others - I don't bother with the Wurlitzer or the Harpischords, and just have two Rhodes, one of them the small EP1, and then the Sparkletop for a more 60s feel.
Gambold
 

Re: Amber Upright

Postby Rusty Mike » 12 Jul 2017, 21:26

criss wrote:Wondering if the new Amber will be a keeper for you, Mike? A Queen upright killer?
I just tested it (the L version), it's nice but I'm not very impressed yet.


Hi criss, I'm not sure yet. I loaded it and will test it out at my next few rehearsals and gigs.

Just playing solo, it certainly has characteristics the Queen does not, but it also seems to be missing some elements that stand out with the Queen. I'll have to see/hear how it works in context.
Mike from Central NJ, USA
Tools: Ten fingers, two feet, middle-age brain, questionable judgement and taste
Nords: Stage 2EX 76 HP, Electro 4D
User avatar
Rusty Mike
 
Posts: 358
Joined: 08 Nov 2011, 21:57
Location: United States
Country: United States of America
Has thanked: 20 times
Been thanked: 154 times
Your Nord Gear #1: Nord Stage 2 EX
Your Nord Gear #2: Nord Electro 4

Re: Amber Upright

Postby Rusty Mike » 12 Jul 2017, 21:29

Gambold wrote:But it would be nice to get some kind of explanation from Clavia on why this is. There have been some good educated guesses on this forum, but the Clavia site itself is using the same copy it used for samples they were offering ten years ago.

It would just be nice to know why the Amber's L sample is 51% larger than the Queen's L - that's not an insignificant amount and I don't think it would reveal State Secrets to let these same passionate users know what's changed in the sampling process that requires so much more memory.


I tend to hear more detail in the sound. Assuming they are capturing at higher bitrates.
Mike from Central NJ, USA
Tools: Ten fingers, two feet, middle-age brain, questionable judgement and taste
Nords: Stage 2EX 76 HP, Electro 4D
User avatar
Rusty Mike
 
Posts: 358
Joined: 08 Nov 2011, 21:57
Location: United States
Country: United States of America
Has thanked: 20 times
Been thanked: 154 times
Your Nord Gear #1: Nord Stage 2 EX
Your Nord Gear #2: Nord Electro 4

Re: Amber Upright

Postby Rusty Mike » 12 Jul 2017, 21:43

Gambold wrote:I tend to be a tech snob and just assume that the newer, larger samples will be better. I'm not a Nord sample aficionado and confess it's not easy for me to always hear striking differences between all the samples. I do insist on playing L sizes since a lot of my playing is solo or alone, and I can hear the difference when resonance and full pedal-down sampling is added. Since I already have those loaded, there's not a lot of reason for me to add a S for group playing.


I guess I've got a more organic approach to it. It's either going to sound good to me or it's not. I still use the Studio Grand 2 from time to time, and it's a fairly low-resolution sample. But it just sounds good to my ears in certain situations.

Gambold wrote:With the Electro 4 I've settled on 2 Grands (Bright and Lady D), the CP80, and 1 Upright (Amber or Grand, can't decide yet) and then a very limited selection of others - I don't bother with the Wurlitzer or the Harpischords, and just have two Rhodes, one of them the small EP1, and then the Sparkletop for a more 60s feel.


The Bright and Lady D offer a good contrast of moods. I see the Amber and Grand Upright as very different, so your final choice will be interesting. The Amber might be more versatile, as it is a fuller sound than the GU, particularly in the midst and lower end. But you can use the EQ to thin it out and probably get close to the cutting sound of the GU.

So, a funny point about the variety of the piano samples and the people who use them. To me, the Sparkletop is the least usable Rhodes sample; the sound just turns me off. It's great that you find it so valuable! Horses for courses, and all that! A true testimony to the variety of the Nord libraries.
Mike from Central NJ, USA
Tools: Ten fingers, two feet, middle-age brain, questionable judgement and taste
Nords: Stage 2EX 76 HP, Electro 4D
User avatar
Rusty Mike
 
Posts: 358
Joined: 08 Nov 2011, 21:57
Location: United States
Country: United States of America
Has thanked: 20 times
Been thanked: 154 times
Your Nord Gear #1: Nord Stage 2 EX
Your Nord Gear #2: Nord Electro 4

Re: Amber Upright

Postby Gambold » 12 Jul 2017, 21:44

>but it also seems to be missing some elements that stand out with the Queen.<

Let us know what you find! We need more objective reviews of the samples. Not every ear is trained as well, so the old saw of "just go by what sounds good to you" isn't always helpful.
Gambold
 

PreviousNext

Return to Nord Piano Forum



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests