Nord User Forum

[analogika]

iPad app would be brilliant.

Yeah, that would be nice. I wonder if it's even feasible. Apple has a lot of limitations regarding USB. In general, the OS does not support writing to a USB device (you can't connect a standard USB hard drive or flash drive, for example), so I don't know if the OS would support Nord writing data to the storage media in the keyboard. The OS does support sending MIDI data over USB of course, but as far as I've seen, not file writing.

Lightning is completely flexible. You can do anything via Lightning, and a number of apps support (their own proprietary) storage devices.

[anotherscott]

Lightning is completely flexible.

but only to the extent that Apple permits it. As you probably know, Apple makes a USB adapter for the Lightning port on an iPad, but it is limited in its application. First (though not an issue for Nord), since Apple does not permit installation of custom drivers under iOS, you can only use USB devices that are class compliant (you can't use anything that, on a computer, would require the installation of a custom driver). But also, not even all class compliant USB devices work. You can plug in a computer keyboard to type, but you can't plug in a mouse, even though USB is designed to support both without custom drivers. And as I mentioned, you can't connect a hard drive or a flash drive. Apple is limited in what USB functions it will support over lightning under iOS.

You can do anything via Lightning, and a number of apps support (their own proprietary) storage devices.

Can you give an example of any app that supports writing a file to any storage device via USB?

[analogika]

Lightning is completely flexible.

but only to the extent that Apple permits it. As you probably know, Apple makes a USB adapter for the Lightning port on an iPad, but it is limited in its application. First (though not an issue for Nord), since Apple does not permit installation of custom drivers under iOS, you can only use USB devices that are class compliant (you can't use anything that, on a computer, would require the installation of a custom driver). But also, not even all class compliant USB devices work. You can plug in a computer keyboard to type, but you can't plug in a mouse, even though USB is designed to support both without custom drivers. And as I mentioned, you can't connect a hard drive or a flash drive. Apple is limited in what USB functions it will support over lightning under iOS.

The whole point of Lightning was to build an interface that could be literally anything, without Apple having to do anything: You just have to include the device driver in your app, and work within Lightning's signalling and power constraints.

You can do anything via Lightning, and a number of apps support (their own proprietary) storage devices.

Can you give an example of any app that supports writing a file to any storage device via USB?

iKlips, iXpand, i-FlashDrive are some options. Note that (as I wrote) they require proprietary USB drives.

I'm pretty sure that it will only be a matter of time until we get regular mass storage support in the Files app, though.

[anotherscott]

The whole point of Lightning was to build an interface that could be literally anything, without Apple having to do anything: You just have to include the device driver in your app, and work within Lightning's signaling and power constraints.

Hmmm. I wonder if that's necessarily true if we're talking about a USB device accessed through Lightning (as opposed to an actual Lightning device, which obviously doesn't necessarily need to be using USB as its protocol for any given device). Though regardless, Apple has a long history of limiting functionality in iOS devices regardless of what its technically capable of.

I'm pretty sure that it will only be a matter of time until we get regular mass storage support in the Files app, though.

I hope you're right! I wouldn't have predicted they'd even give us the Files app, so who knows.

[Blazerunner]

I ask myself this question every day but everyone is just in denial/makes excuses for Nord. It's literally the worse part of the keyboard for all the reasons you mentioned. Their fancy memory they use isn't that great if it's a hindrance to the overall usage of the keyboard. My Memory is swallowed up by a couple of great piano's and Mellotron samples. I want to swap em out and load in the Orchestral sample libraries I have to get the computer and wait all day for the keyboard to clean/rewrite itself with the new samples now that... is something that needs to change.

[cgrafx]

I ask myself this question every day but everyone is just in denial/makes excuses for Nord. It's literally the worse part of the keyboard for all the reasons you mentioned. Their fancy memory they use isn't that great if it's a hindrance to the overall usage of the keyboard. My Memory is swallowed up by a couple of great piano's and Mellotron samples. I want to swap em out and load in the Orchestral sample libraries I have to get the computer and wait all day for the keyboard to clean/rewrite itself with the new samples now that... is something that needs to change.

Ok..
first the piano memory is separate from the sample memory.
Second, there is no way your swallowing up all the sample memory with a few Mellotron samples.
Third, it doesn't take all day to swap samples. You don't have to wipe the entire memory block to upload new samples, just clear enough memory to hold the new ones you want to use.

Lastly, if you really need a keyboard that has a huge library of sounds than don't buy Nord. Use Mainstage or get a Kurzweil or other workstation designed to manage large libraries of sounds.

I'm not apologizing or making excuses for Nord, just frustrated at people that complain that a truck is not a car or a van is not semi. Get the right tool for the job and stop complaining about stuff that is not designed to be what you are asking for, for failing to live up to those expectations.

[analogika]

I ask myself this question every day but everyone is just in denial/makes excuses for Nord. It's literally the worse part of the keyboard for all the reasons you mentioned. Their fancy memory they use isn't that great if it's a hindrance to the overall usage of the keyboard. My Memory is swallowed up by a couple of great piano's and Mellotron samples. I want to swap em out and load in the Orchestral sample libraries I have to get the computer and wait all day for the keyboard to clean/rewrite itself with the new samples now that... is something that needs to change.

You're being disingenuous.

The ENTIRE Nord Mellotron library is a whopping 42 MB. On the oldest Nord keyboard even capable of playing them (apart from the original Nord Wave synthesizer) — the nine-year-old Nord Electro 3, that still leaves 26 MB free for other sounds.

On the next-oldest machine — the 2011 Stage 2 — you have three-hundred-and-thirty-eight MB of memory free after loading ALL of the Mellotron samples.

If I may be blunt:

You have, so far, not presented a single argument that had any basis whatsoever, and virtually every claim you have made about Nord instruments has been demonstrably false — a lie, if you will.

You appear to have bought a Nord Electro 5 (also with 380 MB of sample memory, BTW) without knowing what it is, what it does, and what it's useful for. You're disgruntled and unhappy and are now seeking to bad-mouth the company at whatever chance you get (or grab).

I'm sorry about your ill-informed choice, but please stop blaming Nord for building machines that are built for the profile of their customers — which you, apparently, don't fit.

[anotherscott]

I ask myself this question every day but everyone is just in denial/makes excuses for Nord.

It's not denial/excuses, it's understanding the technology they're using, and what about it is better--and yes, in other ways, worse--than other approaches. There are always trade-offs. If the ones Nord makes bug you, then you should buy a different board, which will have different trade-offs.

My Memory is swallowed up by a couple of great piano's and Mellotron samples.

And what do the competitors' boards give you?

Electro 5 has 1.25 gigs of total sampled sound content to work with, plus the organ engine (which doesn't take up any of that space). What else up to its price ($2200-$2500 SW, $3000 hammer action) offers at least that? Nothing from Roland, Casio, Kawai, Hammond, or Numa. Korg has Krome (unchangeable sample set, no clonewheel, poor actions), Grandstage (unchangeable sample set, only 64 user presets), Vox Continental (unchangeable sample set, no splits, only 16 user presets). Kurzweil has SP6 (unchangeable sample set, few real-time controls) and Forte SE (only 188 mb of changeable sample space). Yamaha has MOXF which qualifies if you add the optional Flash card, that may be closest, since much of it is changeable. Still it has no clonewheel, no extensive library of free sounds to put into that flash... there are some, but most are third-party sounds you need to pay for (or you can load your own samples). Note how few of these have changeable/updatable sample sets. That's what requires the more expensive memory used by Nord and Yamaha. (Whether it's a feature you care enough to pay for is something for you to decide.) Note also how a number of these boards--which are in this respect as close as they have come to Electro--have only recently become available at all. Also how few have the option to have anything like the set of mellotron sounds you want. There are also variables like travel weight, and direct knob access vs. menu-diving, which are very important to some people. Of course, these boards will also have some features the Nord doesn't. And there is just the subjective differences of which ones sound better for your purposes, which is kind of important.

You always have to pick and choose, what are you willing to give up, to get something else that you want. Because you're not going to get it all in the same board, at least not at the same price.

[themixtape]

Absolutely agree with the most recent replies, here.

Nord does what it does, and superbly!

Yes, 1GB may not SEEM like a lot to a lot of people who are used to seeing storage methods at 8GB, 16GB, 64GB, and way more... being as solid-state hard drives are about $100 for half a terabyte (that's 1000GB as we know)... but, the way the memory is used (which has been clearly explained in many threads)... allows the player to instantly access great sounds, that are remembered when the unit is off and turned on again. Instantly change sounds with absolutely no loading time. It's different RAM technology than solid-state storage or standard RAM, at least from what I've read. Yes, swapping pianos is a slow process. But who cares? The quality of the sounds is worth it. Ever play your Electro 5's pianos with headphones? And maybe a touch of reverb? Come on.... you can't say you're insanely inspired.

Also remember that these perfect-sounding pianos (and let's be clear-- they are ALL freakin' amazing)... are.... what? Less than 200MB each? Less than 200MB for most of the XL variations? A typical Kontakt piano library is 2 to 4GB PER PIANO and they sound NOWHERE near as good as these Nords (plus they're quieter and Kontakt can be annoying to use PLUS you need a decent computer/audio interface/DAW, etc)... I have the Kontakt pianos through using NI's Maschine, and I never use the Kontakt pianos. Never. Sometimes they work for certain sounds/recordings. EZ Keys also has pianos that are about 1GB per library. They sound good, yeah... but are they of the Nord quality? I can't say they are. There's a digital-ness in EZ Keys when you listen really closely, that annoys the crap out of me (and another people). Nord stuff doesn't have this.

The Electro 5 stores 1GB of pianos. You can put NEARLY ALL the Nord grands, uprights, Rhodes, Wurlys, etc... into that Electro 5, as MEDIUM. You don't need the XL versions. They still sound damn good. ALMOST EVERY SINGLE PIANO will fit into your Electro 5. Here's the math:

Grands (medium)-- all except Concert Close, Ambient, Silver, and SG1: 513MB (the 4 I excluded are my least favorite, but still sound good)
Uprights (medium)-- Amber, Bambino, Rain, Black, Mellow (the other uprights are great but those are my favorites): 335MB
Rhodes/Wurly/E Grands, etc-- about 120MB total (for all of the main ones)

You still have about 30MB left to add maybe the DX7 samples or whatever, or harpsis if that's your thing. And this isn't even including the Sample Library yet... which you have 256MB to work with. As someone said above, the entire Mellotron samples are about 40MB. There are FANTASTIC sounds in that Sample library PLUS you can sample your OWN stuff, which is dope.

For the people complaining about the memory thing--- I think computers/home studio stuff is the route you need to go. Let's break it down:

If you want to save money, and go almost entirely computer-ish (which isn't a bad thing, I have done it for years).... sell your Electro 5 or whatever Nord model you have, to a willing buyer (there are many, myself included-- I owned the 5D61 briefly and LOVED that board)... get yourself a decent quad-core i7 laptop with 16GB or more of ram, a solid-state hard drive (ideally 500GB or so)... that will set you back about $600 or so (used or new if you can find one, but ideally, at that price, it will probably be a used gaming laptop), then buy Keyscape from Spectrasonics ($400) and call it a day. The new version of Keyscape doesn't require a DAW or recording program to host it. It runs as standalone. You want realistic pianos? That's about as realistic as you can get (Keyscape gets rave reviews across the board, and I've heard the demos too-- they're disgustingly real). But remember: loading times, some audio glitches (if you're playing heavy piano passages with a lot of sustain pedal stuff), and you're tied to a computer. Also, wait... you need a MIDI keyboard controller, since you sold your Electro 5...... so you're at $1000 right now with your investment... you can go with a $200 M-Audio with 61 keys, or you can go with a $500 weighted key Yamaha... ok, now you're at about the price of your Electro 5, used... see? But still, $1500 isn't a huge investment, in this day and age, for great sounds. Further, you can supplement Keyscape with the NI Komplete collection, which is what.. another $600? Wonderful sounds across the board (strings, synths, blah blah blah). That's only $2100... but chances are, you already have a way decent computer, so let's say this entire investment is only $1500.

It all depends on the sounds and what you're willing to work with (are you ok with being tied to a computer and loading plugins, making 16-channel MIDI routing with tracks in your preferred DAW? Using a mouse a lot? Sometimes it annoys people.)

Nord is a well-respected company for a reason. The pros depend on their boards because they work, they sound great, they're light, and they give you all the sounds you need in one place. Plus, they look good on stage. Instantly access/tweak sounds at a show. No loading time.

I dunno.... I just had to chime in here... it's frustrating to read people bash something they don't fully understand. Like the one person said: you want a car to be a truck, or a van to be a semi.

I love my computer setup and my sounds, but when I own a Nord, which sadly isn't at this moment, I play and practice on that thing without touching my computer. That says a lot... it's just extremely inspiring to sit at a Nord... without staring at a screen.

[maxpiano]

And the benefits of changeable sounds (which you do get in a computer, but in few keyboards) is really significant. The biggest differences between older and newer Nords is more features than sound, and that means older models stay sonically "current" for longer. If you bought a Yamaha/Roland/Korg/Kurzweil/Casio/Kawai in 2009, and wanted the piano sound of their 2017 model, you'd have to buy their 2017 model. If you bought a Nord Electro 3 in 2009, you could still load in their 2017 piano sample sets, for free.